Website title: Are These Vectors Orthogonal, Parallel, or Neither?

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    Orthogonal Vectors
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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around determining the relationship between two vectors, specifically whether they are orthogonal, parallel, or neither. The original poster presents a mathematical approach using the dot product and cosine to analyze the vectors.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the dot product and its implications for orthogonality. Some question the calculations and assumptions made regarding the vectors' relationships. Others suggest alternative methods, such as inspection and solving for constants to determine parallelism.

Discussion Status

There is a mix of interpretations regarding the vectors' relationships, with some participants offering insights into different methods of analysis. A few express confusion about certain calculations, while others clarify their understanding of parallelism through factorization.

Contextual Notes

Participants note discrepancies between their findings and the textbook's answers, leading to discussions about potential errors in calculations or interpretations. The conversation reflects a learning process where mistakes are acknowledged as part of understanding the concepts better.

tony873004
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Homework Statement


Determine whether the given vectors are orthogonal, parallel, or neither.

Homework Equations


[tex] \cos \theta = \frac{{\overrightarrow {\rm{a}} \cdot \overrightarrow {\rm{b}} }}{{\left| {\overrightarrow {\rm{a}} } \right|\left| {\overrightarrow {\rm{b}} } \right|}}\,\, \Rightarrow \,\,\theta = \cos ^{ - 1} \left( {\frac{{\overrightarrow {\rm{a}} \cdot \overrightarrow {\rm{b}} }}{{\left| {\overrightarrow {\rm{a}} } \right|\left| {\overrightarrow {\rm{b}} } \right|}}} \right)[/tex]

The Attempt at a Solution


[tex] \begin{array}{l}<br /> \overrightarrow {\rm{a}} = 2i + 6j - 4k,\,\,\,\,\overrightarrow {\rm{b}} = - 3{\rm{\hat i}} - {\rm{9\hat j}}\,{\rm{ + }}\,{\rm{6\hat k}} \\ <br /> \,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\overrightarrow {\rm{a}} \cdot \overrightarrow {\rm{b}} = \left( {2 \cdot - 3} \right) + \left( {6 \cdot - 9} \right) + \left( { - 4 \cdot 6} \right) = - 6 + \left( { - 54} \right) + \left( { - 10} \right) = - 58 \ne 0{\rm{__not_ orthogonal}} \\ <br /> \\ <br /> \,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\cos ^{ - 1} \left( {\frac{{\overrightarrow {\rm{a}} \cdot \overrightarrow {\rm{b}} }}{{\left| {\overrightarrow {\rm{a}} } \right|\left| {\overrightarrow {\rm{b}} } \right|}}} \right) = \cos ^{ - 1} \left( {\frac{{ - 58}}{{\sqrt {2^2 + 6^2 + \left( { - 4} \right)^2 } \sqrt {\left( { - 3} \right)^2 + \left( { - 9} \right)^2 + 6^2 } }}} \right) = \\ <br /> \\ <br /> \,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\cos ^{ - 1} \left( {\frac{{ - 58}}{{\sqrt {4 + 36 + 16} \sqrt {9 + 81 + 36} }}} \right) = \\ <br /> \\ <br /> \,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\cos ^{ - 1} \left( {\frac{{ - 58}}{{\sqrt {56} \sqrt {126} }}} \right) \approx 133.67^\circ \ne 0^\circ \,{\rm{not_ parallel,}}\,\, \\ <br /> \end{array}[/tex]

But the back of the book says parallel.
 
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-4*6=(-24). -6-54-24=-84. That's the dot product of a and b.
 
Dick said:
-4*6=(-24).

:redface:oops. back to 2nd grade for me:smile:. Thanks, Dick.
 
BTW you can also see that they are parallel by inspection. (-3/2)*a=b.
 
[tex] \begin{align*}<br /> \textbf{a}\cdot\textbf{b} = 0 & &\Rightarrow & &\textbf{a} \perp \textbf{b}\\<br /> \textbf{a}\times\textbf{b} = \textbf{0} & &\Rightarrow & &\textbf{a} \parallel \textbf{b}<br /> \end{align*} [/tex]
 
Dick said:
BTW you can also see that they are parallel by inspection. (-3/2)*a=b.

Another student did it this way, but I don't see it. Where does -3 and 2 come from?

foxjwill said:
[tex] \begin{align*}<br /> \textbf{a}\cdot\textbf{b} = 0 & &\Rightarrow & &\textbf{a} \perp \textbf{b}\\<br /> \textbf{a}\times\textbf{b} = \textbf{0} & &\Rightarrow & &\textbf{a} \parallel \textbf{b}<br /> \end{align*} [/tex]

Cross product is next chapter, but thanks, that gives me a good preview of what's to come!
 
tony873004 said:
Another student did it this way, but I don't see it. Where does -3 and 2 come from?

Solve each of these for x:

[tex] \begin{align*}<br /> 2x &= -3\\<br /> 6x &= -9\\<br /> -4x &= 6<br /> \end{align*}[/tex]
 
I still don't get it. How does solving them demonstrate that a and b are parallel? Sorry, but the book does not explain this method.
 
now I get it. The -3 is factored out of b, and the 2 is factored out of a, The remaining parts of a and b are equal, therefore parallel.
 
  • #10
tony873004 said:
now I get it. The -3 is factored out of b, and the 2 is factored out of a, The remaining parts of a and b are equal, therefore parallel.

Exactly. In order for two vectors to be parallel, one must be a constant multiple (in this case [tex]-\frac{3}{2}[/tex]) of the other.
 
  • #11
Now I'm glad I made my original dumb mistake of 6*4=10, or I wouldn't have posted and learned this easier method.
 
  • #12
They say the only way to learn is to make mistakes. ;)
 

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