News What Are Russian Doll Words in English Language Puzzles?

[Math Is Hard]

Here's something to keep HRW up late, and it's a spin off on Curious3141's ideas about "Russian Doll Words"(which was very cool), but not quite exactly the same idea. I am pretty sure I have seen these in word puzzles before, but I started messing with them again recently subconsciously.

What I am after are words that can be "peeled" to make new words.

Strip off the first and last letter and get a new word, and then repeat until you get down to a 2 or 3 letter word root. (Possibly down to a one letter word, like A or I.) 2 letter roots are for words with an even number of letters and 3 or 1 letter roots are for words with an odd number of letters.

For instance ASHAMED counts for ASHAMED and SHAME and HAM. (and then A is a word, so bonus for that!) 4 words total.

MUSINGS counts for MUSINGS and USING and SIN (And I). 4 words total.

These are the maximums I have found: 4 words made from one word 7 letters long.

I wonder if it is possible to find words containing more words or letters than this?

My other (not as good) finds are
FLOWERS: 7 letters, 3 words, FLOWERS, LOWER, and OWE.
PROBING: 7 letters, 3 words, PROBING, ROBIN, and OBI.
MOMENT: 6 letters, 3 words, MOMENT, OMEN, and ME
CANONS: 6 letters, 3 words, CANONS, ANON, and NO

 

[Moonbear]

I'm really bad at these...the best I could come up with was:
BOWL: 4 letters, 2 words, BOWL, OW!

 

[Math Is Hard]

That's a good start, Moonbie! I think the trick is to find a good middle word to build on. Ones that lend themselves to "s", "e" or "ed" endings work well. And words that contain multiple consonants in the beginning are good.
Try some using the middle word ID or OR.

 

[Evo]

Can I cheat and just find any words?

 

[Math Is Hard]

p.s I was trying to find something biology-related for you, MB, but the best I could do was TOM -> STOMA. :)

 

[Moonbear]

p.s I was trying to find something biology-related for you, MB, but the best I could do was TOM -> STOMA. :)

Aww...thanks. I think you get a bonus point for using a word that also has a scientific anagram: Atoms.

 

[Math Is Hard]

Can I cheat and just find any words?

Well, you could, but I think that might be a different game. I should relax the rules and allow proper nouns, though.

 

[Math Is Hard]

Aww...thanks. I think you get a bonus point for using a word that also has a scientific anagram: Atoms.

Neat-o! I never thought of that!

 

[Moonbear]

Towel -> Owe

Dish -> Is

heart -> ear -> A

Okay, this is pathetic, I'm going back to picking on pengwuino.

 

[loseyourname]

I can think of about a thousand that form three words:

SHINTO - HINT - IN
FLAGS - LAG - A
SHADE - HAD - A
TWINS - WIN - I
FLAWS - LAW - A
SAILS - AIL - I
HAIRY - AIR - I
NEATO - EAT - A
HOARY - OAR - A

Tough to find ones that'll form four words, though. If you could take off two letters from the end and beginning, you could make ASHAMED into UNASHAMEDLY and have one that makes five, but I guess that's outside of the rules.

 

[quantumdude]

APATHY-PATH-AT
SPARE-PAR-A
SLIDE-LID-I
SPORES-PORE-OR

I should relax the rules and allow proper nouns, though.

Well in that case...

ATHENS (or ATHENA)-THEN-HE

 

[JamesU]

UBIQUITOUS-QUIT-UI

(Ui is a last name )

 

[quantumdude]

(Ui is a last name )

How about BIQUITOU and IQUITO, are they last names too?

You're supposed to be peeling off one pair of letters at a time.

 

[AKG]

Salient > Alien > Lie > I
Stripes > Tripe > Rip > I
Piraters > Irater > Rate > At

I can't find "Irater" in the dictionary, but I can't find "Angrier" in there either, so "Irater" should be a word.

 

[honestrosewater]

I'll be back later (I'm actually turning a pattern (the deletion of compound constituents) that fell out of the trinonym thread into a little miniresearch project thing and am busy (snoozing) collecting data for it), but I just have to say that this is a perfect example of why I love you, MIH. If I was a teacher, I'd want you as a student, and if I was a student, I'd want you as a teacher, and if I was just about anything else, I'd want you around. You rock SO hard!

P.S. Okay, one first idea: match up pairs of prefixes and suffixes with the same number of letters (e.g., (un-, -ed) (surround a verb stem), (dis-, -ize), (dis-, -ed-s), etc.). This guarantees you at least one peeling, but then you can also look specifically for stems that would form more, e.g., dis-[]-ing, is-[]-in, s-[]-i. Actually, building up from stems does look more promising -- just matching prefixes for suffixes. Say, pick a word: heart. dis-heart-en-s. dis-he(art)-en-ing... Ack, devil woman, you will be the death of me! (I wonder where that saying comes from.)

P.P.S. Is undishearteningly a word? :buggrin:

Oh, EACH peeling needs to produce a word. Oops, autopilot. Okay, Roger. Or do you prefer stripping?

Still, varying the length of each peel (1 letter, 2 letters, etc.) could be interesting too, I think.

Oh, and loseyourname already said what I said. I guess I should read the thread before posting P.S.s.

 

[zoobyshoe]

...but I just have to say that this is a perfect example of why I love you, MIH. If I was a teacher, I'd want you as a student, and if I was a student, I'd want you as a teacher, and if I was just about anything else, I'd want you around. You rock SO hard!

Something's terribly wrong here: you and I are somehow in total agreement about something.

 

[honestrosewater]

Something's terribly wrong here: you and I are somehow in total agreement about something.

It's not so terrible, is it?

Um, I hope this isn't cheating: You can do wildcard searches on OneLook (I adore this site). A * is replaced with a string of any length, and a ? is replaced with a single letter. For instance, I wanted to find some words to fill in

un-[]-ed

So one option is a word that begins with n, ends with e, and what's in between them is a verb

n-[VERB]-e

One search is n?e, which turned up, e.g., naile, giving

unailed -- naile -- ail -- i

Jimmy was sick last week, but now he is unailed. Kosher?

Other example searches: n*e, n?i?e, n??a??e, n*at*e, ?to?, ?atop?...

And actually, you wouldn't need to even think in terms of categories of words; it's just automatic for me, I guess.

 

[honestrosewater]

e-shearers -- shearer -- heare -- ear -- a

Surely you wouldn't reject this already rejected name for the first electronic razor? I don't know how much the poor word can take. Not to mention their dejected inventor, Mr. E. Shearer. I, for one, think that E. Shearer's e-shearers deserve another chance. But I am just a simple country witch doctor.

 

[zoobyshoe]

It's not so terrible, is it?

Not at all. It's nice to find we're in enthusiastic agreement about something, just temporarily disorienting, is all.

 

[Mk]

I can think of about a thousand, this is easy:
Hinder > Hind > Hi > I
Blenders > Blender > Blend > Lend > End > En (the average with of a typeset charachter)
Magistrate > Magi > Ma > A
Ashamed > Ashame > A sham? > Sham > Ham > Am > A
Speakerbox > Speaker > Peaker > Peak > Pea > A
Gulgamesh > Amesh > Mesh
Arrowhead > Arrow > Row > Ow > O
Ledges > Edges > Led > Ed!
Apartheid > Apart > Part > Par > Pa > A
Discussions > Discussion> Discuss > Cuss > Us
Applications > Application > Cations > Ions > Ion > Io > I
Jackass > Ass > As > A
Jackrabbit > Rabbit > Rabbi > Ra > A
Reference > Refer > Ref
Peppermints > Peppermint > Pepper > Pep
Peppermints > Mints > Mint > Min (a dialect of Chinese) > Mi (the third note of a major scale: do re mi...) > I
Waterloo > Water > Ate > At > A
Conditioner > Condition > Ion > Io > I
Conditioner > Condition > Con > On > O
Flippantly > Pant > Ant > An > A
Clocktowers > Clocktower > Tower > Tow > To > O
Clocktower > Clocktower > Clock > Lock > Lo > O
Oxford > Ox > O
Oxford > Ford > For > Fo
Publications > Publication > Public > Pub > P.U. You stink
Publications > Publication > Cations > Cation > Ion > Io > I
Conservationists > Conservationist > Conservation > Cons > Con > On > O

Anybody want to try these?
Advantageousness
Antineodisestablishmenttarianism
Angelicans
Replications
Breadsitcks
Globalization
Magnetohydrodynamics

This is like a cross between Scrabble and factor treeing

 

[loseyourname]

You're doing it wrong, MK. With each successive move, you have to take only one letter off of the beginning and end of each word. This isn't simply about more words being contained within a word.

 

[Gokul43201]

3-word strippers come easily to mind ! (eg : Anna Nicole Smith )

 

[Mk]

You're doing it wrong, MK. With each successive move, you have to take only one letter off of the beginning and end of each word. This isn't simply about more words being contained within a word.

Ohhhh Well I guess I have to rethink my words.

 

[Math Is Hard]

I can think of about a thousand that form three words:

SHINTO - HINT - IN
FLAGS - LAG - A
SHADE - HAD - A
TWINS - WIN - I
FLAWS - LAW - A
SAILS - AIL - I
HAIRY - AIR - I
NEATO - EAT - A
HOARY - OAR - A

Tough to find ones that'll form four words, though. If you could take off two letters from the end and beginning, you could make ASHAMED into UNASHAMEDLY and have one that makes five, but I guess that's outside of the rules.

Nice ones, LYN. I really like SHINTO and HOARY. Bonus points for interesting words!

Yeah, the four word ones are rare birds! That wonderful site that HRW posted (why have I never seen this before?!??) should be helpful in tracking down more of them.

APATHY-PATH-AT
SPARE-PAR-A
SLIDE-LID-I
SPORES-PORE-OR
ATHENS (or ATHENA)-THEN-HE

ooh, I really like APATHY! Must keep this one in mind for future Scrabble matches!

Salient > Alien > Lie > I
Stripes > Tripe > Rip > I
Piraters > Irater > Rate > At

I can't find "Irater" in the dictionary, but I can't find "Angrier" in there either, so "Irater" should be a word.

:!) :!) :!) Wowser!

And I would play IRATER on a Scrabble board any day - I think it's perfectly legal!

 

[Math Is Hard]

I'll be back later (I'm actually turning a pattern (the deletion of compound constituents) that fell out of the trinonym thread into a little miniresearch project thing and am busy (snoozing) collecting data for it), but I just have to say that this is a perfect example of why I love you, MIH. If I was a teacher, I'd want you as a student, and if I was a student, I'd want you as a teacher, and if I was just about anything else, I'd want you around. You rock SO hard!

That made my whole week. Got to be one of the nicest compliments I've ever received. Especially since I only created this thread to torment and distract you! How's the research project going by the way?

unailed -- naile -- ail -- i
e-shearers -- shearer -- heare -- ear -- a

how about emailed-- maile -- ail -- i ?

I wasn't sure about maile at first but it looks legit, though both listings are classified as obsolete.

1. A small piece of money; especially, an English silver half-penny of the time of Henry V.
2. Rent; tribute.

Can a word "expire"?

 

[Math Is Hard]

Something's terribly wrong here: you and I are somehow in total agreement about something.

uh oh. Sign of the end times?
But thanks, Zoob.

3-word strippers come easily to mind ! (eg : Anna Nicole Smith )

*Guffaws and slaps knee*

 

[pattylou]

MIH: Did you forget "sing" in your original example?

 

[pattylou]

My other (not as good) finds are
FLOWERS: 7 letters, 3 words, FLOWERS, LOWER, and OWE.
PROBING: 7 letters, 3 words, PROBING, ROBIN, and OBI.
MOMENT: 6 letters, 3 words, MOMENT, OMEN, and ME
CANONS: 6 letters, 3 words, CANONS, ANON, and NO

For that matter, the following are also words:

Ower
Robing
En
Can, Anons ( http://www.wordwebonline.com/en/ANON ), on

(Sorry, I play scrabble, I can't help it. I'm seeking help, I promise.)

 

[Math Is Hard]

MIH: Did you forget "sing" in your original example?

Hi Patty. If you meant in MUSINGS, no, the letters must be stripped from front and back only one pair at a time. That's the game rules.

Thus MUSINGS > USING > SIN > I

 

[Math Is Hard]

(Sorry, I play scrabble, I can't help it. I'm seeking help, I promise.)

We need to meet for a game soon!
And some sushi, too! I haven't forgotten.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I just found a minor one:

Pants --> ant

 

[Math Is Hard]

Congratulations. You found an ant in your pants.
Now you got to dance.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Congratulations. You found an ant in your pants.
Now you got to dance.

Ok, sugar. I'll teach you how to jive an' wail.

Street --->tree.

I found a tree on my street,
So I guess I'll go eat.

 

[Math Is Hard]

A nice three-worder. You actually have
Street --->tree --> re

 

[zoobyshoe]

A nice three-worder. You actually have
Street --->tree --> re

A bizarre word like "re" gives a conservative person like myself the shudders. This is why I don't play scrabble.

Here's more:

money ---> one
bottom ---> otto (I figure names count)
change---> hang-->an

(These aren't too spectacular. I guess I'm the kind of stripper who comes out pretty much nekked to begin with.)

 

[Math Is Hard]

A bizarre word like "re" gives a conservative person like myself the shudders. This is why I don't play scrabble.

Here's more:

money ---> one
bottom ---> otto (I figure names count)
change---> hang-->an

(These aren't too spectacular. I guess I'm the kind of stripper who comes out pretty much nekked to begin with.)

I'll take money and change , but you have to go down to a 2-word root if the word is even, so tt is a deal-breaker for bottom.

 

[quantumdude]

Do acronyms count if they're in the dictionary?

 

[zoobyshoe]

... but you have to go down to a 2-word root if the word is even,...

I have no idea what this means. But anyway:

where--->her
strolls--->troll
plunger-->lunge
king-->in
swing--->win-->I
chew--->he
drums--->rum
power-->owe

 

[zoobyshoe]

strains-->train
grounds--->round
events--->vent
charms--->harm
preserves--->reserve
poverty--->overt
marks-->ark
plates--->late
jellyfish--->ellyfis

 

[Math Is Hard]

Do acronyms count if they're in the dictionary?

That's a really good question.

I would be on board with SCUBA or FUBAR, but a little less inclined toward something like CIA or MIS. There are several acronyms which eventually graduated to words in their own right (e.g. POSH and of course, the F-word ) so that makes the case for acronyms more persuasive to me.

Which acronymns were you thinking of?

 

[Math Is Hard]

I have no idea what this means. But anyway:

It means that if you have an even number of letters, you stop stripping when you reach a two letter word. That two letter word is your "root".
If you have an odd number of letters, you stop stripping when you get down to a three letter word, that word is your root - unless you can pare off those front and back letters (of the 3-letter root word) and get down to a one letter word root. That's a bonus word.

where--->her

works!

strolls--->troll

Doesn't work, since "rol", your root, is not a word.

plunger-->lunge

Here, you have "ung" as your root, so that's a problem.

king-->in

good!

swing--->win-->I

great!

chew--->he
drums--->rum
power-->owe

yep.

strains-->train

sorry, rai won't do for the root word.

grounds--->round

oun is spoiling the middle.

events--->vent

This is very good, but what you actually have is events--->vent --> en

charms--->harm

you would have to make a convincing case for "ar" as a word, matey!

preserves--->reserve

Nope. The buck stops at "eserv".

poverty--->overt

Nice try but "ver" is going to be a tough sell.

marks-->ark

good!

plates--->late

Good. Three words here: plates--->late --> at

jellyfish--->ellyfis

Funny! But, um.. no.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Strip off the first and last letter and get a new word, and then repeat until you get down to a 2 or 3 letter word root. (Possibly down to a one letter word, like A or I.) 2 letter roots are for words with an even number of letters and 3 or 1 letter roots are for words with an odd number of letters.

O.K. I understand now. I didn't understand that a 2 or 3 letter word was the distance you had to go. I just thought you were mentioning it since it was as far as you could go.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I'll take money and change:smile

Incidentally, what are you doing with these? Memorizing them for scrabble?

 

[honestrosewater]

How's the research project going by the way?

It's going.

how about emailed-- maile -- ail -- i ?

I wasn't sure about maile at first but it looks legit, though both listings are classified as obsolete.

1. A small piece of money; especially, an English silver half-penny of the time of Henry V.
2. Rent; tribute.

Sounds good. I'm easy. What about remaileds? Make sure to get the addresses right this time; I don't want to have to remail all of those remaileds again!

Can a word "expire"?

According to this reprint of the Ask Mister Langauge Person column, according to the Ask Mister Langauge Person column, according to Mister Langauge Person, according to The American Funeral Industry Council, the preferred term is "bought the farm."

 

[honestrosewater]

Take a gander at what I stumbled upon while trying to find out if anyone ever picked up verbid: morewords. Searching for flower gives a good idea of what the site does:

What information is available for each word?

For each word:

* Definitions are shown (if available, see above, or a list of links to dictionaries)
* Direct one-word anagrams
* Hooks (all words that can be found by adding one letter to the word - these are in bold)
* All words that can be found by adding one letter to the set of letters that form the word, in any order
* For words under eight letters, all shorter words that can be made from the letters
* Links to pages listing words starting with the word, containing the exact word anywhere, and ending with the word, optionally sorted by length of word (example: words ending with gry)
* Words that can be formed from the current word by changing anyone letter
* Link to browse words which are one character longer
* Link to previous word (alphabetically)
* Link to next word (alphabetically)

Hey, the site's creator's last name, Hoare, is a strip word and part of another: shoared, from shoar, an alt. spelling of shore, which can be used as a verb, as in shore up.

shoared -- Hoare -- oar -- a

 

[Math Is Hard]

What about remaileds? Make sure to get the addresses right this time; I don't want to have to remail all of those remaileds again!

HRW, check this out:
http://www.emailprivacy.info/remailers

remailers --> emailer --> maile --> ail --> i

THAT'S 5, BABY!

According to this reprint of the Ask Mister Langauge Person column, according to the Ask Mister Langauge Person column, according to Mister Langauge Person, according to The American Funeral Industry Council, the preferred term is "bought the farm."

That site is hilarious!

 

[Math Is Hard]

Take a gander at what I stumbled upon while trying to find out if anyone ever picked up verbid: morewords. Searching for flower gives a good idea of what the site does:

That is an awesome site and a terrible distraction. My workday is shot to hell now.

Hey, the site's creator's last name, Hoare, is a strip word and part of another: shoared, from shoar, an alt. spelling of shore, which can be used as a verb, as in shore up.

shoared -- Hoare -- oar -- a

ooh, cool beans! I wonder if the site creator has noticed this about his name? I would imagine so!