What if Einstein equivalence principle is proven wrong one day?

[DaveC426913]

I don’t think this is required, as long as the measurements are close in both location and time

If you were allow that then any sufficiently fine measurement would detect tides.

 

[PAllen]

If you were allow that then any arbitrarily fine measurement would detect tides.

No, the idea is pick some achievable precision for you measurements. Then there exist corresponding bounds on spacetime extent in which any number of such measurements will fail to distinguish whether the box is near a large body or in intergalactic space (for example). Of course, the nature of the body also influences the extent of the bounds.

 

[only1god]

i would be prepared, but Why pitchforks?

 

[DaveC426913]

No, the idea is pick some achievable precision for you measurements. Then there exist corresponding bounds on spacetime extent in which any number of such measurements will fail to distinguish whether the box is near a large body or in intergalactic space (for example).

All right.Local effectively means: only measurements of distances in time or space small enough that tides can't be detected.

 

[PAllen]

All right.Local effectively means: only measurements of distances in time or space small enough that tides can't be detected.

Yes.

 

[DaveC426913]

i would be prepared, but Why pitchforks?

Because it would make a lot of scientists very angry.

Some might be angry because they see their life work going up in a puff of smoke, but many would be angry because they think you a charlatan or fraud. Only time (and your notes) would tell which turns out to be true.

 

[only1god]

Because it would make a lot of scientists very angry.

Some might be angry because they see their life work going up in a puff of smoke, but many would be angry because they think you a charlatan or fraud. Only time (and your notes) would tell which turns out to be true.

I think the first one is more obvious than the second one, you are right in the first one because many will feel envy. Altought they wouldn't come to my door it will be funny hitting them if they come lol.

Anyway, Would i win a nobel prize for it? lol

 

[PAllen]

I think the first one is more obvious than the second one, you are right in the first one because many will feel envy. Altought they wouldn't come to my door it will be funny hitting them if they come lol.

Anyway, Would i win a nobel prize for it? lol

Possibly, but I think you are much more likely to win two large lottery jackpots in a row than succeed in this.

 

[DaveC426913]

Anyway, Would i win a nobel prize for it? lol

Perhaps if it were backed up with the mathematics that proves it.
How's your differential equations?

 

[only1god]

Pallen and Dave, What if i show you myself in this thread that i found an idea of a local experiment that indeed shows us a way to distinguish an accelerated frame from a gravitational field? ( That's the reason I'm asking all this, and i still have to work on my idea deeply)

 

[PAllen]

Pallen and Dave, What if i show you myself in this thread that i found an idea of a local experiment that indeed shows us a way to distinguish an accelerated frame from a gravitational field? ( That's the reason I'm asking all this, and i still have to work on my idea deeply)

If you present it as “here is an idea that is probably wrong, but I can’t see how”, we would be happy to discuss it. Otherwise, not so much. A number of such ideas have been presented and readily exposed. In one case, it was presented as a challenge, and I quickly the exposed the fallacy in a humorous way.

 

[only1god]

If you present it as “here is an idea that is probably wrong, but I can’t see how”, we would be happy to discuss it. Otherwise, not so much. A number of such ideas have been presented and readily exposed. In one case, it was presented as a challenge, and I quickly the exposed the fallacy in a humorous way.

I understand. In fact i was one of those who presented ideas but at the end were wrong. However in my current idea i don't see any errors. I've never in my head understood why two things that are different could be equal. Yes, gravity is an acceleration but that doesn't mean it's just an ilusion as GR affirms, it should be something that exists as a force. That's why for me Einstein's EP should be wrong.

 

[Dale]

Maybe some experiment or idea are still without being tested?

New experiments do not magically make old experiments go away. Since new experiments cannot make old experiments go away then that means the old experiments confirming it to $10^{-15}$ are still valid. So a new experiment sensitive down to the $10^{-17}$ level might detect a difference.

If so, what I described above would happen since similar thins have already happened in the past.

The question here is, leaving apart that limit, Will that mean if the idea is true that Einstein's EP is wrong?

Yes this would result in a limitation to the domain of validity for GR.

 

[PAllen]

New experiments do not magically make old experiments go away. Since new experiments cannot make old experiments go away then that means the old experiments confirming it to $10^{-15}$ are still valid. So a new experiment sensitive down to the $10^{-17}$ level might detect a difference.

If so, what I described above would happen since similar thins have already happened in the past.

Yes this would result in a limitation to the domain of validity for GR.

Just to play a little devil’s advocate, if there were some new form of matter that coupled to gravity differently the others (e.g. it’s inertial mass measured by EM forces, on giving it a charge, was different from its passive gravitational mass), then an experiment on this new form of matter could have large discrepancies for the POE, without invalidating other experiments. Everyone, including me, would think this ridiculously unlikely, but the consequence would be large. The whole differential geometry framework of GR would come to be viewed as a historical accident, not worth propagating, once a successful new theory were developed (that also could also replicate the plethora of confirmed GR predictions).

 

[PeterDonis]

What if i show you myself in this thread that i found an idea of a local experiment that indeed shows us a way to distinguish an accelerated frame from a gravitational field? ( That's the reason I'm asking all this, and i still have to work on my idea deeply)

Personal theories and personal speculations are off topic in this forum. You are not the first person, or even the thousandth, to come here posting about an idea you have that you think violates some fundamental principle of physics. In the past, PF has tried to provide subforums where such ideas could be proposed. We found that the signal to noise ratio was zero: no idea ever turned out to be right, and the discussions about the many wrong ones accomplished nothing except to take up a lot of time for members who could have been doing more productive things. So we stopped doing it.

 

[PeterDonis]

The OP question has been answered. Thread closed.