What is the macroscopic cross section for natural uranium to thermal neutrons?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the macroscopic fission cross section for natural uranium in relation to thermal neutrons. Participants explore the dependencies of this value on various factors, including neutron energy and the physical form of uranium.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant, Kirk, inquires about the value of ν∑f for natural uranium, defining ν as the average number of neutrons released from fission and ∑f as the macroscopic fission cross section.
  • Another participant suggests that a CANDU reactor engineer might have the relevant information.
  • Kirk notes that developing a value for ∑f depends on atomic density, which varies with the form of uranium (elemental, alloy, or ceramic), and mentions that ν depends on neutron energy, particularly for U-235 in a thermal spectrum.
  • Participants discuss the energy distribution of fast neutrons from fission, indicating that it peaks around 1 MeV and falls off rapidly up to 10 MeV, with references to fusion reactions producing higher energy neutrons.
  • Kirk later clarifies that he is specifically looking for the macroscopic cross section for thermal neutrons and mentions finding a value of ν∑f for UO2 to be about 0.2274 cm^-1 from the D&H tables.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying views on the dependencies of ν∑f, particularly regarding neutron energy and the form of uranium. There is no consensus on a definitive value for the macroscopic cross section for natural uranium, as the discussion remains open to interpretation based on different conditions.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the importance of specifying neutron energy and the physical form of uranium when discussing cross sections, indicating that these factors significantly influence the values being sought.

Kirk Truax
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Hey all,

Does anyone happen to know the value of ν∑f for natural uranium? Here ν is the average number of neutron released from fission and ∑f is the macroscopic fission cross section of uranium.

Kirk
 
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I'll wager there's a CANDU reactor engineer aboard who knows.
.
 
Kirk Truax said:
Hey all,

Does anyone happen to know the value of ν∑f for natural uranium? Here ν is the average number of neutron released from fission and ∑f is the macroscopic fission cross section of uranium.

Kirk
Developing a value for ∑f depends on the atomic density, which depends on the form, e.g., elemental, alloy or ceramic. What form is one considering? The value of ν depends on neutron energy, and in a thermal spectrum, it will depend on U-235.
 
Astronuc said:
The value of ν depends on neutron energy,

Natural U being mostly this ,,
https://t2.lanl.gov/nis/data/endf/endfv-pdf/u238.pdf
upload_2017-5-24_8-44-58.png
 
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jim hardy said:
Yeah, but that's for fast neutrons. Fast neutrons from fission have a peak distribution around 1 MeV and the energy distribution falls off rapidly up to 10 MeV. With d+t fusion, one gets up to 14.1 MeV neutrons. To go higher, one pretty much needs 20+ MeV protons and spallation reactions.

The OP did mention whether he flux was thermal, epithermal or fast.
 
Astronuc said:
The OP didn't mention whether he flux was thermal, epithermal or fast.

Fixed it for you

old jim
 
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Astronuc said:
Yeah, but that's for fast neutrons. Fast neutrons from fission have a peak distribution around 1 MeV and the energy distribution falls off rapidly up to 10 MeV. With d+t fusion, one gets up to 14.1 MeV neutrons. To go higher, one pretty much needs 20+ MeV protons and spallation reactions.

The OP did mention whether he flux was thermal, epithermal or fast.
Hey guys,

You were right, I definitely did leave out that vital bit of information. I was simply looking for the macroscopic cross section for thermal neutrons. I was modeling a sub-critical pile with a large amount of graphite moderation. Turns out I was able to find a ν∑f for UO2 to thermal neutrons to be about 0.2274 cm^-1. This was from the good ole D&H tables.

Kirk
 
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