What Would Happen in a Vacuum Chamber?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of water and air in a vacuum chamber, specifically examining the effects on temperature and pressure in a sealed container of water, as well as the behavior of a balloon filled with air placed within that container. The scope includes theoretical considerations of thermodynamics and heat transfer in a vacuum environment.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether the temperature of water in a vacuum chamber would remain constant, especially if the chamber is placed in a sub-zero environment.
  • Another participant compares the scenario to a Thermos bottle, suggesting that the setup is similar due to the vacuum insulation.
  • It is proposed that the balloon immersed in water will not expand because water is effectively incompressible, although pressure may change with temperature.
  • One participant asserts that heat transfer does not require a medium and emphasizes that radiation is a significant mode of heat transfer in a vacuum.
  • There is a correction regarding the rate of heat transfer by radiation, with some participants discussing the proportionality to the fourth power of absolute temperature.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the effects of temperature and pressure in the vacuum chamber scenario. While some agree on the principles of heat transfer, there is contention regarding the specifics of how heat dissipation occurs and the behavior of the balloon.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention the importance of distinguishing between absolute and gauge pressure, and the implications of water's bulk modulus of elasticity, indicating that assumptions about pressure and temperature may affect the discussion.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying thermodynamics, heat transfer, or vacuum technology, as well as individuals curious about the physical behavior of materials in extreme conditions.

billbaty
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What would happen under these circumstances:

A sealed container of water in a vacuum chamber. Since water doesn't expand like air, I assume that there would be no extra pressure within the sealed container once the air was evacuated around it. Since there would be no, or very little air surrounding the container, and since heat requires a medium to dissipate, would the temperature of the water inside the container stay virtually constant or close to the temperature it was when placed into the vacuum chamber? If the vacuum chamber was placed in a sub-zero environment would the water still stay around its original temperature?

Also, while on the vacuum topic, since the air in a sealed balloon will expand and blow up large in a vacuum, what would happen if that sealed balloon with a small amount of air would be placed into the above example's sealed container of water in a vacuum chamber? Would there be no extra pressure inside the container and therefore the balloon will stay its same size?
 
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For your second question, since water is effectively incompressible, the balloon immersed in water won't expand. The pressure will change as you change the temperature, but the volume will stay the same.
 
Heat does NOT require a medium to dissipate. Heat transfer cooling by radiation alone occurs at a rate proportional to the fourth power of the difference in absolute temperature.

Be careful of how you are measuring your pressure, absolute or gauge. Water in an elastic container will still boil when the vapor pressure exceeds the applied pressure.

Water does have a bulk modulus of elasticity compressibility.
 
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Doug Huffman said:
Heat does NOT require a medium to dissipate. Heat transfer cooling by radiation alone occurs at a rate proportional to the fourth root of the difference in absolute temperature.

indeed ! :)

a lack of a medium only takes care of 2 of the 3 methods of heat transfer ( conduction and convection)
IR radiation doesn't require a medium

Dave
 
Doug Huffman said:
Heat transfer cooling by radiation alone occurs at a rate proportional to the fourth root of the difference in absolute temperature.
I think the rate is proportional to the difference in the fourth power of absolute temperature, not the fourth root.
##P = \sigma_{SB} \epsilon_1 \epsilon_2 (T_1^4-T_2^4)##
 
Khashishi said:
I think the rate is proportional to the difference in the fourth power of absolute temperature, not the fourth root.
You are of course correct.
 

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