Why Don't Metals Get Charged by Friction?

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    Charged Friction Metals
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the phenomenon of charging metal objects through friction, comparing them to insulators like combs and plastic rods. Participants explore the mechanisms behind charge transfer and the behavior of charges on different materials, particularly focusing on metals.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question why metal objects, such as nails, do not get charged by friction in the same way as insulators like combs and rods.
  • One participant asserts that metals can indeed be charged by friction, suggesting that charge can be transferred and that it can be demonstrated through practical applications like making a compass.
  • Another participant explains that on insulators, the transferred charge remains localized, while in metals, the charge spreads over the surface, leading to a lower surface charge density.
  • There are mentions of specific cases, such as the operation of a van der Graaf generator, where charge can build up on metals.
  • One participant challenges the idea that charge is not transferred when magnetizing metal, indicating a potential misunderstanding of the processes involved.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether metals can be charged by friction, with some asserting they can and others suggesting they cannot in the same manner as insulators. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specifics of charge transfer in metals versus insulators.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved questions regarding the conditions under which charge transfer occurs in metals, including the influence of surface charge density and the specific mechanisms at play in different materials.

manjuvenamma
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Why don't metal objects such as a nail get charged by friction like the famous comb, plastic rod or glass rod - all insulators?
 
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electric discharge through gases

Can some one kindly explain or give a reference link that explains why it happens what it happens in electric discharges through gases like William Crookes expermient of 1870s and JJ Thomsons experiments with cathode rays? Covering also such important aspects such as what would have happened if we did not remove air/gas in the tube? Why electrons did not ionise the gas inside at low pressures etc? Thanks in advance. Basically, I want to know how our present knowledge of atomic structure explains the experiments and its results?
 
manjuvenamma said:
Why don't metal objects such as a nail get charged by friction like the famous comb, plastic rod or glass rod - all insulators?
They do.

You can make a compass this way. Googling, I can't seem to find it, but I was a Boy Scout... (I'm curious, so I'll look more tomorrow)
 
manjuvenamma said:
Why don't metal objects such as a nail get charged by friction like the famous comb, plastic rod or glass rod - all insulators?
On an insulator, like a comb, the transferred charged stays where it was placed.
In a metal, the charge spreads over the entire surface of the metal, so that the surface charge density is usually small.
There are cases where the charge transferred to a metal can build up.
This happens in the van der Graaf generator.
 
russ_watters said:
They do.

You can make a compass this way.
No charge is transferred when a boy (or girl) scout magnetizes metal.
 

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