Will a Photon Clock Tick Faster or Slower When Moving Towards You?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the behavior of a photon clock moving towards an observer at a significant fraction of the speed of light, specifically whether it appears to tick faster, slower, or at the same rate when approaching versus receding from the observer. The scope includes conceptual reasoning and relativistic effects, particularly the Doppler effect.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the clock will appear to tick at the same rate regardless of its motion, arguing that the speed of light remains constant.
  • Others suggest that the distance between the observer and the clock changes, affecting the time it takes for light to travel from the clock to the observer.
  • A participant mentions the relativistic Doppler effect, noting that spectral lines are red-shifted when moving away and blue-shifted when approaching, implying a relationship to the perceived ticking rate.
  • Another participant emphasizes the need to clarify what the clock reads, questioning how the blue shift relates to the actual ticks of the clock.
  • A detailed example is provided, illustrating how the perceived ticking rate changes due to the clock's motion and the effects of time dilation and light travel time.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether the clock ticks faster, slower, or at the same rate when moving towards the observer. The discussion remains unresolved, with multiple competing perspectives presented.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight the complexity of the problem, indicating that assumptions about the clock's motion and the observer's perspective are critical to understanding the situation. The mathematical steps involved in deriving the perceived ticking rate are not fully resolved.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying relativistic physics, particularly the effects of motion on time perception and the Doppler effect in light. It may also appeal to individuals exploring conceptual challenges in understanding time and motion in a relativistic context.

Iconoclast
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A Youtube channel has just uploaded a video proposing a challenge. The question is pretty simple. It can be summed up to: A clock is moving towards you at 50% the speed of light, and eventually it passes you and continues its travel. When the clock is moving towards you, will it appear to tick faster, slower, or at the same rate than when it is moving away from you?

Watch from 0:47 or so.


Attempt at a solution
It seems to me that yes, the clock will be ticking at the same rate. Afterall, the velocity is the same and the speed of light is absolute (that means, when the clock is approaching you, it won't make light travel faster towards your eyes).

So, can you help? It's worth a t-shirt.
 
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Draw a spacetime diagram...

Is there an acoustic analogue?
 
The speed of light approaching doesn't change, but the distance between you and the clock does and so does the time it takes for the light to travel from it to you.
 
Iconoclast said:
It seems to me that yes, the clock will be ticking at the same rate..
But that's not the question. The question is will it APPEAR to ...
 
Why is this hard? Even if you didn't know the equation for the relativistic doppler effect, all you would need to know is that distant spectral lines (i.e. clock ticks) are red-shifted if they are moving away from us and clue-shifted if moving toward us.
 
That doesn't answer the question. Sure, the clock will look bluer, but what will it read?
 
Iconoclast said:
That doesn't answer the question. Sure, the clock will look bluer, but what will it read?
It comes about as close to answering the question as anyone can without just blurting out the answer - which is generally discouraged here.

If the clock looks bluer, then the successive wave peaks are closer together. How are the wave peaks related to the ticks of the clock and how are the ticks of the clocks related to what it reads?
 
Vanadium 50 said:
clue-shifted

I meant blue shifted...but I think I like "clue shifted" better.,
 
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Iconoclast said:
That doesn't answer the question. Sure, the clock will look bluer, but what will it read?

The reading on the clock and blue shift are relate. Imagine the clock starts tick 1 when it 1 light sec away and is moving towards you at 0.6c You will see tick one 1sec later.
Now one second later(according to the clock) it starts tick 2. According to you, this tick occurred 1.25 sec after the first (time dilation), by which time the clock has moved a distance of 0.75 light sec closer to you. The light from this tick reaches you 0.25 sec later. The time between tick 1 and when you see tick 1 is 1 sec and the time between tick 1 and when you see tick 2 is 1.5 (1.25 +0.25) sec. so the time difference between seeing tick 1 and tick 2 is only 0.5 sec, so you see the clock tick twice as fast.
using the relativistic Doppler shift formula gives a blue-shift factor of 2 for something approaching at 0.6c, So you see the clock tick fast by the same factor as you see the frequency of its light increased.
 

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