What Are the Advantages of Using SVG for Web Design?

[dduardo]

Which browser do you use? If your using IE you should consider switching to firefox:

http://www.mozilla.org/

 

[mattmns]

I use Firefox (fx) on windows xp and linux. However, I have been recently trying out Konqueror on linux, as the fx mouse gestures are funky on linux (for me anyway).
If you are using IE, you should consider switching to anything that is NOT Internet Explorer

 

[Kerrie]

firefox all the way baby!

 

[dduardo]

firefox all the way baby!

Yeah, let's stick it to Evo for not wanting to switch.

 

[Pengwuino]

I hear Microsoft is trying to make a big step with IE7. Tabbed browsing, "real security"... some other crap... probably won't work so I am sticken with Da Fox.

 

[dduardo]

I hear Microsoft is trying to make a big step with IE7. Tabbed browsing, "real security"... some other crap... probably won't work so I am sticken with Da Fox.

I guess you haven't been hearing what people have been saying about IE7

http://www.windowsitpro.com/Article/ArticleID/47208/47208.html

"My advice is simple: Boycott IE. It's a cancer on the Web that must be stopped. IE isn't secure and isn't standards-compliant, which makes it unworkable both for end users and Web content creators. Because of their user bases, however, Web developers are hamstrung into developing for IE at the expense of established standards that work well in all other browsers. You can turn the tide by demanding more from Microsoft and by using a better alternative Web browser. I recommend and use Mozilla Firefox, but Apple Safari (Macintosh only) and Opera 8 are both worth considering as well."

 

[Evo]

Yeah, let's stick it to Evo for not wanting to switch.

I can't switch! Besides, I get to use "special" stuff that you guys can't. <sticks tongue out>

But I agree with dduardo, mere mortals should use firefox.

 

[Pengwuino]

Its a beta though, how can you judge a beta.

Oh wait its microsoft, retail and beta mean the same thing

 

[mattmns]

IE Secure? Are they joking? They have had plenty of time, and plenty of money to fix their security problems.

Some of IE's Vulnerabilies have been there forever. Check out secunia's report of the most popular browsers. There is a "highly critical" Vulnerability that has been there since August of 2003.

IE: http://secunia.com/product/11/
Firefox: http://secunia.com/product/4227/
Opera: http://secunia.com/product/4932/
Safari: http://secunia.com/product/5289/

 

[mattmns]

I can't switch! Besides, I get to use "special" stuff that you guys can't. <sticks tongue out>

But I agree with dduardo, mere mortals should use firefox.

You get to use "special stuff"? Did not you say a while ago that your IE at work does not even have tabs? Tabs in the sense of firefox's tabs, not tasbar buttons

 

[dduardo]

For those who want a peak at IE7 here is a screenshot:

http://www.winsupersite.com/images/showcase/ie7_promo_b1xp.jpg

 

[Evo]

Its a beta though, how can you judge a beta.

Oh wait its microsoft, retail and beta mean the same thing

True. Microsoft refers to their customers as the "vast unpaid research department".

But most of you weren't working on computers before Windows, I was.

 

[dduardo]

Its a beta though, how can you judge a beta.

Oh wait its microsoft, retail and beta mean the same thing

Microsoft has already stated too that they are not going to be adding any major CSS functionality to IE7. All they are doing is "just enough" to appease home users. Microsoft is giving the big FU to all developers. This really sucks for developers like me who want to build richer websites but get held back by IE.

 

[Evo]

You get to use "special stuff"? Did not you say a while ago that your IE at work does not even have tabs? Tabs in the sense of firefox's tabs, not tasbar buttons

I also don't have any problems with the "buttons" as you call them. Yes, what I use for work is a bit different from what is on the market.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

Currently I am using the browser that is in Outlook. A stripped down version of IE it seems like to me. On my own computer I prefer Opera though.

 

[Evo]

Aww, my Norton anti-virus just popped up and said it detected a worm trying to install itself and blocked it. :!) God bless it.

 

[Moonbear]

True. Microsoft refers to their customers as the "vast unpaid research department".

But most of you weren't working on computers before Windows, I was.

Well, I was playing around with computers before windows, mostly playing Jeopardy and writing English papers (that printed on a dot matrix printer). Oh, wait, and there was the Commodore 64, and programming in BASIC to make Mr. Bo Jangles (the stick figure that danced). But, yeah, I think "working" with computers began with Windows 3.11 for me. Well, college assignments were done on those little square Mac pluses. I remember thinking they were way too fast to read while scrolling down a page.

 

[dduardo]

Evo, are you using the built in window's firewall? It could be the worm I posted in my Internet Alert:

https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=85159

 

[mattmns]

Aww, my Norton anti-virus just popped up and said it detected a worm trying to install itself and blocked it. :!) God bless it.

That is terrible, luckily you have Norton. I hope everyone that is using IE has Norton or another AntiVirus detector, because as you pointed out you never know what will automatically install by itself when using IE.

 

[Evo]

That is terrible, luckily you have Norton. I hope everyone that is using IE has Norton or another AntiVirus detector, because as you pointed out you never know what will automatically install by itself when using IE.

I'm not foolish enough to use IE and not have something like Norton enabled.

I had a Commodore 64, I believe it's still in the basement.

 

[Moonbear]

Microsoft has already stated too that they are not going to be adding any major CSS functionality to IE7. All they are doing is "just enough" to appease home users. Microsoft is giving the big FU to all developers. This really sucks for developers like me who want to build richer websites but get held back by IE.

Well, I think everyone should just start developing websites that look wonderful with the other browsers and don't work with IE. When people can't access anything on the web anymore, maybe they'll finally switch, or Microsoft will be forced to do something about it. Besides, it'll keep the AOL users away.

 

[Evo]

Evo, are you using the built in window's firewall? I could be the worm I posted in my Internet Alert:

https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=85159

No, a friend installed something else. It was my Symantec software that caught the worm. I wasn't even doing anything.

 

[Moonbear]

Evo, are you using the built in window's firewall? I could be the worm I posted in my Internet Alert:

https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=85159

dduardo is the worm!

 

[Evo]

dduardo is the worm!

Ok dduardo, if you're that serious I'll switch, really.

 

[dduardo]

But most of you weren't working on computers before Windows, I was.

I have been surrounded by Unix my whole life. My dad used at&t unix at work and was the person who brought linux to the house. Also, when I was in elementary school I used Apple computers.

 

[mattmns]

My dad had a commodore 64 when I was a kid. I am not sure of how it worked, all I know is that I used it to play games on it.

 

[dduardo]

dduardo is the worm!

Are you happy, I fixed it.

 

[Moonbear]

Are you happy, I fixed it.

It was funnier with the typo. Just getting even for some wisecracks I owed you for.

 

[Evo]

It's too late, half of PF now believes that dduardo is sending them computer worms. You know how rumors get started...

 

[Evo]

Ah, here it is again, it's "The Thing" trojan horse. I wonder what it tries to do?

 

[dduardo]

You should be using a real firewall. One that can do stateful packet inspection and block syn attacks. Someone could easily disable your internet connection.

 

[Moonbear]

Ah, here it is again, it's "The Thing" trojan horse. I wonder what it tries to do?

Does it look anything like a penguin?

If you spray the computer liberally with bug spray, that'll keep any worms from infecting it. There may be side effects similar to spitting coffee on the computer though.[/color][/size]

 

[Evo]

Does it look anything like a penguin?

It DOES look like a penguin!

 

[dduardo]

It's your fault your using Wndows. You could atleast get a Mac.

 

[Evo]

It's your fault your using Wndows. You could atleast get a Mac.

This is my daughter's computer.

They don't give us Mac's at work, everything is Windows based.

 

[Moonbear]

You could atleast get a Mac.

Hey! You make that sound like a bad thing!

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

Firefox now, but I might switch back to IE when 7 comes out.

 

[dduardo]

Evo, maybe you should buy your daughter an ibook or a powerbook.

http://www.apple.com/ibook/

 

[dduardo]

Firefox now, but I might switch back to IE when 7 comes out.

Boooo, hissss, snarl, grunt

As a web developer yourself, you should know better.

I didn't want to say this but anyone who uses IE is Microsoft's ______.

I'll leave the blank to your imagation.

 

[Moonbear]

Evo, maybe you should buy your daughter an ibook or a powerbook.

http://www.apple.com/ibook/

Yep, you should! I love my powerbook! Random people walk up to me in airports and tell me they like my laptop. (I'm serious, they really do.) It might be more coffee-resistant than PCs too. (Okay, I might not be serious about that part.)

 

[yourdadonapogostick]

i run Firefox on Ubuntu and Windows XP

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

Microsoft has already stated too that they are not going to be adding any major CSS functionality to IE7. All they are doing is "just enough" to appease home users. Microsoft is giving the big FU to all developers. This really sucks for developers like me who want to build richer websites but get held back by IE.

http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2005/07/29/445242.aspx
http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2005/04/26/412263.aspx

btw, no one likes an elitist slashdot-ish attitude

 

[mattmns]

I am confused about those articles. I saw that, what Greg had posted, the first part, and then the same thing that dduardo had posted about IE not conforming to standards a few days later. Is it just speculation, and we have to wait til it ships to see what is really going on?

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

I am confused about those articles. I saw that, what Greg had posted, the first part, and then the same thing that dduardo had posted about IE not conforming to standards a few days later. Is it just speculation, and we have to wait til it ships to see what is really going on?

Those blogs I posted are straight from MS developers. In the end we need to wait until it's done and released to pass judgement.

 

[dduardo]

We'll see how well the implement these features, but I'm not too hopeful. Microsoft is going to be very conservative when changing anything in IE7 because of compability concerns with older versions of IE.

And how is this going to improve the stituation with IE5 and IE6? It isn't like they are going to backport any of these improvements to their previous browsers or allow you to run IE7 on older versions of windows.

Things still missing: div over select, div tables, SVG, css3, xforms, E4X, ajax acessability, themes

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

We'll see how well the implement these features, but I'm not too hopeful. Microsoft is going to be very conservative when changing anything in IE7 because of compability concerns with older versions of IE.

And how is this going to improve the stituation with IE5 and IE6? It isn't like they are going to backport any of these improvements to their previous browsers or allow you to run IE7 on older versions of windows.

Things still missing: div over select, div tables, SVG, css3, xforms, ajax acessability, themes

All people have to do is upgrade to IE7. I don't understand why they would ever consider backporting anything, that is the point of the new version instead of patching.

I am sure div over select, and div tables will be fixed, they are well known problems. SVG, there is a plugin already for IE. Personally I've never ever encountered any SVG. Firefox isn't even completely CSS3 compliant, I think just with CSS3 selectors, hell I'm not sure if WC3 is done with CSS3 yet. There is a plugin for xforms for IE. Again, 99% of people will never run into xforms outside Office, it is along way from being used on websites. IE does have some nasty AJAX bugs, but I'm sure they will tighten them up. The next version of Vbulletin will have a lot of AJAX. And themes well, I could care less about making the browser look pretty

 

[dduardo]

It isn't as simple as just upgrading to IE7, you have to be running windows xp first.

 

[mattmns]

Don't you also need to be running SP2?

 

[dduardo]

Don't you also need to be running SP2?

Yes, that too. which is really going to hinder adoption on windows xp. Most people are just going to wait until Vista. It's going to take 4 years to begin undoing the damage that has already been done with the previous versions of IE.

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

Yes, that too. which is really going to hinder adoption on windows xp. Most people are just going to wait until Vista. It's going to take 4 years to begin undoing the damage that has already been done with the previous versions of IE.

The only official date so far for IE7 is the concurrent release with Windows Vista, so SP2 is irrelevant.