A box over an inclined plane with a mass, no friction

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SUMMARY

This discussion focuses on a statics problem involving a box of mass m on an inclined plane with mass M at an angle α. The key equations for the accelerations in the x and y components are derived using Newton's laws. The correct formulas for the accelerations are: a1x = -m2 * g * tan(α) / (m2 * sec2(α) + m1 * tan2(&alpha)) for the box, and a2x = m1 * g * tan(α) / (m2 * sec2(α) + m1 * tan2(&alpha>)) for the plane. The discussion emphasizes the importance of understanding the distribution of acceleration between the two masses.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of Newton's laws of motion
  • Familiarity with trigonometric functions such as sine, cosine, and tangent
  • Knowledge of static equilibrium concepts
  • Ability to manipulate algebraic expressions involving forces and masses
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  • Learn about the application of Newton's laws in statics problems
  • Explore the relationship between forces and acceleration in multi-body systems
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Students in physics or engineering courses, particularly those studying statics, mechanics, or dynamics. This discussion is beneficial for anyone seeking to understand the behavior of objects on inclined planes and the application of Newton's laws in static scenarios.

SqueeSpleen
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Homework Statement


We have an inclined plane with a mass ##M## and an angle ##\alpha## and a box of mass ##m## over it.
Everything is at the instant 0 (it's a problem of static, no dynamics).
a) What's the acceleration in the component x of the box?
b) What's the acceleration in the component y of the plane?
c) What's the acceleration in the component x of the box?

Homework Equations


Newton laws, momentum conservation I guess.

The Attempt at a Solution


I have tried but I'm failing.
The solutions are supposed to be
a)
$$
a_{1x}
\dfrac{ -m_{2} \cdot g \cdot \tan (\alpha) }{ m_{2} \sec^{2} (\alpha) + m_{1} \tan^{2} (\alpha) }
$$
b)
$$
a_{2x}
\dfrac{ m_{1} \cdot g \cdot \tan (\alpha) }{ m_{2} \sec^{2} (\alpha) + m_{1} \tan^{2} (\alpha) }
$$
c)
$$
a_{2x}
\dfrac{ -( m_{1} +m_{2} ) \cdot g \cdot \tan^{2} (\alpha) }{ m_{2} \sec^{2} (\alpha) + m_{1} \tan^{2} (\alpha) }
$$
I've tried several times, and the best I have got for a) was
$$
a_{1x}
\dfrac{ -m_{2} \cdot g \cdot \tan (\alpha) }{ m_{2} \sec^{2} (\alpha) + m_{1} \sec^{2} (\alpha) }
$$
I'm surely missing something.
The reasoning beggings as follows:
The magnitude of the force of the box over the inclined plane is ##g m_{1} \sin (\alpha )## as is the normal component of the gravity. That force as a direction ## (\sin( \alpha ), - \cos(\alpha))##.
Here is where I got confused. I know if the ramp has infinite mass, or is "glued" to the floor which to this porpuse is the same, the box would only have left a the tangent component of the force.
The thing is, I'm not sure how acceleration gets distributed between two masses.
I remember that in the case of colliding "balls" it was something like
$$
\dfrac{ m_{1} }{ m_{1}+m_{2}}
$$
and when assuming that is when I almost got the result, but I had ##\sec## in both places, no ##\tan##. So I guess I'm missing a ##\sin##. Any one knows where can I read theory to help me understand this a bit better and solve this problem? I guess if I can start playing with Newton Laws until I get the correct result, but I would like to have a better understanding.
 

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SqueeSpleen said:

Homework Statement


We have an inclined plane with a mass ##M## and an angle ##\alpha## and a box of mass ##m## over it.
Everything is at the instant 0 (it's a problem of static, no dynamics).
If this is a statics problem, then the answer to all of the questions below is 0.

a) What's the acceleration in the component x of the box?
b) What's the acceleration in the component y of the plane?
c) What's the acceleration in the component x of the box?
One of these is supposed to be the x-component of acceleration of the plane, right?

Homework Equations


Newton laws, momentum conservation I guess.

The Attempt at a Solution


I have tried but I'm failing.
I've tried several times, and the best I have got for a) was
$$
a_{1x}
\dfrac{ -m_{2} \cdot g \cdot \tan (\alpha) }{ m_{2} \sec^{2} (\alpha) + m_{1} \sec^{2} (\alpha) }
$$
I'm surely missing something.
The reasoning beggings as follows:
The magnitude of the force of the box over the inclined plane is ##g m_{1} \sin (\alpha )## as is the normal component of the gravity. That force as a direction ## (\sin( \alpha ), - \cos(\alpha))##.
Here is where I got confused. I know if the ramp has infinite mass, or is "glued" to the floor which to this porpuse is the same, the box would only have left a the tangent component of the force.
The thing is, I'm not sure how acceleration gets distributed between two masses.
I remember that in the case of colliding "balls" it was something like
$$
\dfrac{ m_{1} }{ m_{1}+m_{2}}
$$
and when assuming that is when I almost got the result, but I had ##\sec## in both places, no ##\tan##. So I guess I'm missing a ##\sin##. Any one knows where can I read theory to help me understand this a bit better and solve this problem? I guess if I can start playing with Newton Laws until I get the correct result, but I would like to have a better understanding.
From your description, I have no idea what you were doing. Please show your work.

You mentioned conservation of momentum in the relevant equations. Did you use it?
 

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