A force of attraction between any two objects with mass?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of gravitational attraction between two objects with mass, exploring both Newtonian and Einsteinian perspectives. Participants examine how this force operates over varying distances and the implications of the inverse square law on gravitational interactions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express confusion about how gravitational attraction works over large distances, questioning if the force dissipates significantly when objects are far apart.
  • It is noted that the gravitational force between two masses decreases with the square of the distance, suggesting that while the force diminishes, it never becomes zero.
  • One participant attempts to clarify the relationship between distance and gravitational force, explaining that reducing the distance between two objects increases the force exponentially.
  • Another participant emphasizes that gravitational force exists only where mass is present, indicating that there is no force in the space between two masses.
  • There is a mention of the significant effects of gravity over vast distances, such as those found in galaxies.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants display a mix of understanding and confusion regarding gravitational attraction, with some agreeing on the principles of the inverse square law while others remain uncertain about the implications of distance on gravitational force.

Contextual Notes

Some participants appear to have differing interpretations of gravitational force and its behavior over distance, leading to a lack of consensus on certain aspects of the discussion.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to students and enthusiasts of physics, particularly those exploring concepts of gravity and gravitational forces in relation to mass and distance.

Tribo
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I'm having trouble grasping some of the text in my textbook. In addition to proposing that objects (and the earth) fall because they are attracted by a force, Newton apparently claimed "that there is a force of attraction between any two objects with mass." Einstein went on to suggest "that the force of attraction between two objects is due to the mass causing the space around it to curve."

Well if I'm on the beach and drop a rock in the sand next to a seashell, I can see how this would work. But if the seashell is a mile down the shore and I drop the rock I don't understand how it would attract the second object towards itself or vise versa. After some distance, their forces would dissipate. Wouldn't they?

Zitzewitz, Paul W., Todd George. Elliott, David G. Haase, Kathleen A. Harper, Michael R. Herzog, Jane Bray. Nelson, Jim Nelson, Charles
A. Schuler, and Margaret K. Zorn. "Chapter 1." Physics: Principles and Problems. New York: Glencoe/McGraw-Hill, 2005. 10. Print.
 
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Tribo said:
But if the seashell is a mile down the shore and I drop the rock I don't understand how it would attract the second object towards itself or vise versa. After some distance, their forces would dissipate. Wouldn't they?
The force between two masses falls off inversely with the square of the distance. So sure, the force from that seashell a mile away won't amount to much, but it's still there.
 
So if I'm understanding this right it's kinda like:
rock (at 16) 4 2 4 shell (at 16)

?
 
Tribo said:
So if I'm understanding this right it's kinda like:
rock (at 16) 4 2 4 shell (at 16)

?
Can you rephrase that? I don't get what you mean.
 
The object's weight continually dissipates until it collides with the other object's dissipating weight.
 
Tribo said:
The object's weight continually dissipates until it collides with the other object's dissipating weight.
An object's weight usually means the gravitational force exerted on it by the earth. So that doesn't dissipate.

The gravitational force that two objects exert on each other gets smaller with increasing distance, following an inverse square law.
 
Doc Al said:
An object's weight usually means the gravitational force exerted on it by the earth. So that doesn't dissipate.

The gravitational force that two objects exert on each other gets smaller with increasing distance, following an inverse square law.

Right, so if I take two objects that are 16 miles apart, their force is the smallest in the middle, but it will never become zero. The number is found by squaring the distance between them.
 
Tribo said:
Right, so if I take two objects that are 16 miles apart, their force is the smallest in the middle, but it will never become zero.
The force only exists where mass exists. There's no mass "in the middle" and thus no force there.

Tribo said:
The number is found by squaring the distance between them.
When the two objects are 16 miles apart, there is a certain gravitational force between them. Let's call that force F. Now if you move them so they are 8 miles apart, reducing the distance by a factor of 2, the strength of the force between them quadruples to 4F. Similarly, if you move them so they are 32 miles apart, increasing the distance by a factor of 2, the strength of the force between them reduces by a factor of 4 to become F/4.
 
Ah, okay, I think I get it now. Thank you for your help, you've been very patient with me!
 
  • #10
Tribo said:
Ah, okay, I think I get it now.
Excellent.

Welcome to PF, by the way!
 
  • #11
Gravity has a significant effect over enormous distances - just think how big some galaxies are.
 

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