Why Do Some Women Use Threats of Castration in Relationships?

[Chrono]

Here's an ode to use nice guys. I know I'm not the only one out here.

Ode To Nice Guys

 

[Evo]

Personally I prefer nice guys. I want a guy that treats with me respect, and shows me love and affection.

I think any girl worth having will feel the same way.

 

[brewnog]

I stopped reading at the bit about sitting patiently outside changing rooms.

 

[loseyourname]

I remember discussing this piece a couple years back somewhere else. The general conclusion came to is that that guy is a whiner and deserves what he gets. He isn't just a "nice" guy; he's a pushover. When you allow women (or anyone, for that matter) to walk on you, you get walked on.

 

[Gza]

I agree with loseyourname. The "nice guy" he describes, sounds like a loser-type, who doesn't have much of a way with women, and resorts to following them around, and moping about how he can never get into a relationship, when it is really HIM who set the boundaries for a platonic relationship based on his interaction with women.

 

[franznietzsche]

The "nice guy" he describes, sounds like a loser-type, w

I didn't know there was a difference.

 

[hypatia]

I married a very handsom party-boy..20 yrs later he is still just that. So I divorced him. Now I'm looking for a nice guy...someone who cares more about the world and less about his haircut.

 

[Evo]

Being a nice guy should not mean being a spineless slave with no self confidence. I haven't had a chance to read the link, but I guess that's what that guy is. Doesn't sound like a "nice guy" as much as a doormat.

Chrono, a "nice guy" should be confident and self assured and not allow himself to be walked on. Being nice in my book means polite and thoughtful.

hypatia, my ex-husband looked in the mirror more than I did. I know what you mean, he never grew up either.

 

[jcsd]

I married a very handsom party-boy..20 yrs later he is still just that. So I divorced him. Now I'm looking for a nice guy...someone who cares more about the world and less about his haircut.

Hmm, someone bald then :tongue2:

 

[Gale]

I read the link and that guy isn't so bad. He just likes a girl, and even though she doesn't like him, he's still nice to her. I think the part about going to the party is a bit lame... but whatever. he doesn't deserve to be walked all over. He deserves someone who will appreciate him for trying to so hard. What do you expect a guy to do? He isn't going to be any better off with girls if he decides to be uncaring, unsympathetic, pushy, or mean. Obviously he's just not the type to be more aggressive. You have to appreciate that, and just be glad that he's at least nice.

 

[Chrono]

Chrono, a "nice guy" should be confident and self assured and not allow himself to be walked on. Being nice in my book means polite and thoughtful.

Isn't that the kind of guy the girl described in the write-up?

Why does everyone always confuse being nice with being weak?

 

[arildno]

Why does everyone always confuse being nice with being weak?

It is our time's version of the bully's self-justification:
To dislike hitting someone is to be cowardly.

 

[franznietzsche]

Chrono, a "nice guy" should be confident and self assured and not allow himself to be walked on. Being nice in my book means polite and thoughtful.
.

You see this is where 'nice guys' fail. To guys, a nice guy isn't confident or self-assured, because those traits are associated with arrogance, and how could an arrogant guy ever be nice?

What most guys don't understand is that without the confidence, nothing else you do means anything. Thats why 'jerks' who are arrogant and confident, always win out. PLain and simple. Confidence wins the day every time. The other things, don't mean anything without that.

 

[arildno]

From my knowledge, women prefer men who are self-confident AND nice, whereas teenage girls fall in love with jerks.
Self-confidence is not the same as the willingness to bully others.

 

[franznietzsche]

Self-confidence is not the same as the willingness to bully others.

I didn't say it was.

 

[Moonbear]

You see this is where 'nice guys' fail. To guys, a nice guy isn't confident or self-assured, because those traits are associated with arrogance, and how could an arrogant guy ever be nice?

I haven't read the link yet, but I don't need to in order to address this comment. Being confident and self-assured is NOT synonymous with arrogance. Confidence is attractive, arrogance is a turn-off, and women do know the difference.

 

[tribdog]

I think I'm a nice guy and confident without arrogance.

and I hope you a-holes think I'm superior.

 

[Gale]

There are somethings guys get confused with nice, and something guys don't realize aren't nice... but being nice is better, no matter what. you should be just nice, without compromising yourself, that's the way to be.

((Men... :uhh: I swear every day I'm closer and closer to becoming a lesbian.))

 

[Moonbear]

I remember discussing this piece a couple years back somewhere else. The general conclusion came to is that that guy is a whiner and deserves what he gets. He isn't just a "nice" guy; he's a pushover. When you allow women (or anyone, for that matter) to walk on you, you get walked on.

Worse, from that rant, he came across as utterly patronizing (especially with that line about going to bars with women to provide a buffer against the rest of the evil males...paraphrased here). A combination of that, and a pathetic puppy who follows women around uninvited. Why would you sit outside the changing room if you're not dating them and haven't been invited along? For that matter, I wouldn't drag along someone I was dating while I shopped for clothes and expect them to sit around outside the changing room. That's borderline creepy, not to mention stupid, because it just sets you up to be asked the inevitable question, "What do you think of this outfit on me?" and the danger of having to answer, "It makes your butt look fat." Maybe once you're in a secure relationship and trust each other's opinions on clothing, you might ask him to hang around and give you advice about which outfits look best on you as you try them on, but you don't do that when you're just starting out dating, and certainly not if you're not even dating!

 

[franznietzsche]

I think I'm a nice guy and confident without arrogance.

and I hope you a-holes think I'm superior.

And see what being nice has gotten you?

What did those LEGO bricks do for you?

 

[Gale]

Worse, from that rant, he came across as utterly patronizing (especially with that line about going to bars with women to provide a buffer against the rest of the evil males...paraphrased here). A combination of that, and a pathetic puppy who follows women around uninvited. Why would you sit outside the changing room if you're not dating them and haven't been invited along? For that matter, I wouldn't drag along someone I was dating while I shopped for clothes and expect them to sit around outside the changing room. That's borderline creepy, not to mention stupid, because it just sets you up to be asked the inevitable question, "What do you think of this outfit on me?" and the danger of having to answer, "It makes your butt look fat." Maybe once you're in a secure relationship and trust each other's opinions on clothing, you might ask him to hang around and give you advice about which outfits look best on you as you try them on, but you don't do that when you're just starting out dating, and certainly not if you're not even dating!

It is a secure relationship. They're really really good friends. I had a friend like that. Someone i'd trust with anything in the world. It was hard on our relationship sometimes cause i had a boyfriend. But he was nice because he did have the opportunity to abuse our friendship because i trusted him so much. Eventually i broke up with my lame boyfriend, and my friend asked me out. We had a great relationship that lasted a long time.

 

[tribdog]

never take a guy to shop for clothes. If you ask me how an outfit looks I'm going to say fine. just to get out of the store. just buy an outfit and bring it home. If I really hate it, and I would have to REALLY hate it, I might say something about it, but I'd buy you a new outfit. Well, I'd pay for a new outfit. The only reason I'd be willing to sit outside a dressing room would be to watch all the other girls going in and out.

 

[Moonbear]

Seriously, the only time I've seen men around outside the women's fitting rooms (other than the old married guys who are holding their wive's purses, as if somehow the women couldn't take them into the room with them ) is when the swimsuits come out. The men seem to take great interest in helping the women pick out a swimsuit. Otherwise, the women head for the fitting room and the men head for the hardware dept, or the music store, or to the food court. Heck, even I'm not inclined to stand around waiting for a friend trying on clothes when I go shopping with someone else, but then I don't make clothes shopping into a group activity for that reason.

 

[franznietzsche]

It is a secure relationship.

For her, yes.

I had a friend like that.

No, you used a guy like that. At least that's how he saw it.

Someone i'd trust with anything in the world. It was hard on our relationship sometimes cause i had a boyfriend.

Supports the above points.

Eventually i broke up with my lame boyfriend, and my friend asked me out. We had a great relationship that lasted a long time.

Well, even bad things come to end it would seem.

 

[tribdog]

And see what being nice has gotten you?

What did those LEGO bricks do for you?

they made me feel good by making someone I really like happy.

edit:wow, I got turned on by me. Don't I sound like I'm a perfect catch?

 

[Evo]

Isn't that the kind of guy the girl described in the write-up?

Why does everyone always confuse being nice with being weak?

This guy is being dishonest. He doesn't want to be "just a friend" as he is leading these girls to believe, he is doing all this in the pathetic hope that they will see him as a romantic interest instead of as "only a friend" and then blaming them when they remain honest and really want him as "just a friend".

He seems to think these girls are attractive and that's why he wants them romantically. I'll bet there is a less attractive, but very nice girl that would give anything to date him, but he's too busy chasing after the unobtainable. She's probably wondering why this guy is acting like such an idiot by chasing after these girls.

This guy is a bit messed up in my opinion.

If a guy presents himself as "just a friend" then he should not expect anything more. This has nothing to do with being a nice guy.

Don't pretend to be ok with just being friends if that is not what you really want. You will just end up bitter like this guy.

This doesn't mean that "real" friends can't become more.

Chrono, you are a truly nice guy and I don't think you are false like the guy in that link. You are honest in letting the girl know you are interested in dating and that's the right approach. It just takes time to find the "right" person sometimes.

 

[franznietzsche]

This guy is being dishonest. He doesn't want to be "just a friend" as he is leading these girls to believe, he is doing all this in the pathetic hope that they will see him as a romantic interest instead of as "only a friend" and then blaming them when they remain honest and really want him as "just a friend".

Fair enough, but then this utterly disproves the existence of women's intuition, if these women couldn't figure this out in the first place. Sorry ladies, can't have it both ways, no matter how hard you try.

He seems to think these girls are attractive and that's why he wants them romantically.

Why else would he have that kind of interest in them? And note, attractive doesn't just mean physically, though for most guys that may be the attitude, some of us have other ideas of what constitutes attractive. I've met several absolutely gorgeous women (i mean model quality) of whom none were what i would consider attractive. Definitely beautiful, and sexually attractive, but that was it. They didn't have anything else to offer really.

I'll bet there is a less attractive, but very nice girl that would give anything to date him, but he's too busy chasing after the unobtainable.

There is no such thing as the unobtainable, IMHO.

She's probably wondering why this guy is acting like such an idiot by chasing after these girls.

Kinda like the guy who is trying to win these women over by being nice feels when they date abusive boyfriends (if they do, let's not get into that argument, you understand my point).

This guy is a bit messed up in my opinion.

Which makes him rather normal, really.

If a guy presents himself as "just a friend" then he should not expect anything more. This has nothing to do with being a nice guy.

Thats just it, he's not trying to present himself as a friend, he's trying to win their hearts by being nice, and trying to brownnose his way into their pants. Granted that makes him no less of a dumbass, but he's certainly not trying to pass himself off as 'just a friend'.

Don't pretend to be ok with just being friends if that is not what you really want. You will just end up bitter like this guy.

You'll end up bitter anyway. Just look at me.

This doesn't mean that "real" friends can't become more.

Real? What is real?

Chrono, you are a truly nice guy and I don't think you are false like the guy in that link. You are honest in letting the girl know you are interested in dating and that's the right approach. It just takes time to find the "right" person sometimes.

Thats such a load of crock. (well, except for the first sentencei guess).

People have this bizarre fixation on one person, like the person you want to date now will be the person you marry, so you'd better not screw it up. Please.

Assume the relationship will fail. Assume that you aren't right for each other. Okay, now that we have that part out of the way, go ask her out and enjoy the part that happens before that.

Life works so much better once you accept the inevitabilities and then say 'screw it' and just get on with it.

Assume that the worst case is what will happen every time. Ok, now you don't have to deal with doubt, now just go do it.

Its like guys being worried about rejection. Why worry? It happens, or it doesn't, so what? Its not like it matters.

The way i see things, every date i go on is to see if the woman is worth my time, not if i am worthy of hers. If she passes, then fine, we'll see about a second date. If she fails, then oh well, no loss.

There is no "right" person. I have to agree with Chris Rock on this one: you're not going to find your solemate, you'll be lucky just to find a mate. So get over it already.

Further, a thing typical of 'nice guys' is that they will develop emotional attachment before they've been on a date with the girl. What is the point of this? It is at best counterproductive, because it makes you exceedingly self-conscious, and makes you try too hard to get her to reciprocate. Not the way it should work.

 

[member 5645]

Here's my ode to the "nice guys":

http://www.heartless-*****es.com/rants/niceguys/niceguys.shtml

Why "Nice Guys" are often such LOSERS

You hear it all the time: "He was such a NICE Guy, and she's such a Heartless ***** for dumping him."

I get letters from self-professed Nice Guys, complaining that women must WANT to be treated like ****, because THEY, the "Nice Guy" have failed repeatedly in relationships. This is akin to the false logic that "Whales are mammals. Whales live in the sea. Therefore, all mammals live in the sea."

If you have one bad relationship after another, the only common denominator is YOU. Think about it.

What's wrong with Nice Guys? The biggest problem is that most Nice Guys (tm) are hideously insecure. They are so anxious to be liked and loved that they do things for other people to gain acceptance and attention, rather than for the simply pleasure of giving. You never know if a Nice Guy really likes you for who you are, or if he has glommed onto you out of desperation because you actually payed some kind of attention to him.

Nice Guys exude insecurity -- a big red target for the predators of the world. There are women out there who are "users" -- just looking for a sucker to take advantage of. Users home-in on "Nice Guys", stroke their egos, take them for a ride, add a notch to their belts, and move on. It's no wonder so many Nice Guys complain about women being horrible, when the so often the kind of woman that get's attracted to them is the lowest form of life...

Self-confident, caring, decent-hearted women find "Nice Guys" to be too clingy, self-abasing, and insecure.

Nice Guys go overboard. They bring roses to a "lets get together for coffee" date. They try to buy her affections with presents and fancy things. They think they know about romance, but their timing is all wrong, and they either come-on too strong, too hard and too fast, OR, they are so shy and unassertive, that they hang around pretending to be "friends", in the hope that somehow, someway, they will get the courage up to ask her out for a "date".

They are so desperate to please that they put aside their own needs, and place the object of their desire on a pedestal. Instead of appreciating her, they worship her. We are only human, and pedestals are narrow, confining places to be -- not to mention the fact that we tend to fall off of them.

They cling to her, and want to be "one" with her for fear that if she is out of sight, she may disappear or become attracted to someone else. A Nice Guy often has trouble with emotional intimacy, because he believes that if she learns about the REAL person inside, she will no longer love him.

Nice Guys are always asking HER to make the decisions. They think it's being equitable, but it puts an unfair burden of responsibility on her, and gives him the opportunity to blame her if the decision was an unwise one.

Nice Guys rarely speak up when something bothers them, and rarely state clearly what it is they want, need and expect. They fear that any kind of conflict might spell the end of the relationship. Instead of comprimising and negotiating, they repeatedly "give in". When she doesn't appreciate their sacrifice, they will complain that, "Everything I did, I did for her.", as if this somehow elevates them to the status of martyrs. A woman doesn't want a martyr. She wants an equal, caring, adult partner.

Nice Guys think that they will never meet anyone as special as she is. They use their adoration as a foundation for claiming that "no one will ever love her as much as I do." Instead of being a profound statement of their devotion, this is a subtle, but nasty insult. It is akin to saying to her: "You are a difficult person, and only *I* can ever truly love you, so be thankful I'm here."

The nice guy -needs- to believe that he is the best person for the object of his desires, because otherwise his insecurities will overrun him with jealousies and fear. The truth of the matter is that there are many people out there who can be a good match for her. We rarely stop loving people we truly care about. Even if we no longer continue the relationship, the feelings will continue... But love isn't mutually exclusive. We can (and do) love many people in our lives, and romantic love is really no different. Though he may love her immensely, there will likely be other people who have loved her just as much in her past, and will love her just as much in the future. The irony of it all is: "Who would want to go out with someone who was inherintly unlovable anyways?"

More than loving the woman in his life, a Nice Guy NEEDS her. "She is my Life, my only source of happiness..." YECH! What kind of a burden is that to place on her? That SHE has to be responsible for YOUR happiness? Get a grip!

Another mistake Nice Guys make is to go after "hard luck" cases. They deliberately pick women with neuroses, problems, and personality disorders, because Nice Guys are "helpers". A Nice Guy thinks that by "helping" this woman, it will make him a better, more lovable person. He thinks it will give him a sense of accomplishment, and that she will appreciate and love him more, for all his efforts and sacrifice. He is usually disappointed by the results.

This ultimately boils down to the fact that Nice Guys don't like themselves. Is it any wonder women don't like them? In order to truly love someone else, you must first love yourself. Too often Nice Guys mistake obsession for "love".

Get this Guys: INSECURITY ISN'T SEXY. IT'S A TURNOFF.

You don't have to be an ego-inflated, arrogant jerk. You just have to LIKE yourself. You have to know what you want out of life, and go after it. Only then will you be attractive to the kind of woman with whom a long-term relationship is possible.

 

[franznietzsche]

Here's my ode to the "nice guys":

http://www.heartless-*****es.com/rants/niceguys/niceguys.shtml

I agree completely.

Edit: Well, not completely, but pretty close.

 

[tribdog]

Do you know who I think is an attractive guy? Astronuc.
I know he looks like a dirty, crazy, claim-jumping, donkey-stealing prospector he still comes across as being a really nice guy who thinks before he speaks. If I was gay and about 50 years older I'd hit on him.
Know who else I think is attractive? Me but you probably already knew that. If I was a bit younger and gay I'd hit on me.

 

[Evo]

That's the best article I've seen phatmonkey.

 

[Moonbear]

That's the best article I've seen phatmonkey.

I second that. That article was dead on!

 

[Chrono]

It just takes time to find the "right" person sometimes.

You're telling me.

 

[tribdog]

doesn't anyone else think Astronuc is attractive? I can't be the only one can I?
apparently I am. sorry Astro. where the heck is astro anyway? it's been a while.

 

[Chrono]

doesn't anyone else think Astronuc is attractive? I can't be the only one can I?

I don't think I've seen her.