Ax≡ay (mod m) iff x≡y (mod m/(a,m))

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter kingwinner
  • Start date Start date
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the theorem stating that ax≡ay (mod m) if and only if x≡y (mod m/(a,m)), exploring its application and implications in modular arithmetic. Participants are examining a specific proof from a textbook and questioning the validity of certain steps taken in that proof, particularly regarding the conditions under which the theorem can be applied.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about the application of the theorem, questioning why the proof assumes b is a multiple of a and why the theorem allows division by (a,m) instead of a.
  • Another participant challenges the first by clarifying that the congruence ax≡b (mod m) does not imply b is a multiple of a, providing an example to illustrate this point.
  • A later reply suggests that the theorem can still apply by rewriting a and b in terms of their greatest common divisor, (a,m), and that b can be assumed to be divisible by (a,m) for the congruence to have solutions.
  • Some participants discuss the potential confusion arising from using the same variable names in different contexts, suggesting that adjustments can be made to align with the theorem's form.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the application of the theorem. There are competing interpretations regarding the conditions necessary for the theorem to hold and the validity of the proof steps discussed.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion related to the assumptions about divisibility and the conditions under which the theorem is applicable. The use of variable names in multiple contexts adds to the complexity of the discussion.

kingwinner
Messages
1,266
Reaction score
0
note: (a,m)=gcd(a,m)

Theorem: ax≡ay (mod m) if and only if x≡y (mod m/(a,m))

And then in the middle of a certain proof later on, my textbook says:
Suppose (a,m)|b.
Then BY THE ABOVE THEOREM(?),
ax≡b (mod m) if and only if (a/(a,m))x ≡ b/(a,m) (mod m/(a,m))?

But I don't see exactly why the above theorem will give us this result.
First of all, I don't think on the RHS, b is necessarily a multiple of a.
Secondly, the theorem says we can divide the LHS and RHS by a (not (a,m)), and divide the modulus by (a,m), NOT a. But in that proof, they divide everything by (a,m) which is not what the theorem says.
Could someone please show me how to apply the theorem in a way that will lead us to this result? I really don't see how...

Is it also true that ax≡ay (mod m) if and only if
(a/(a,m))x ≡ (a/(a,m))y (mod m/(a,m))?

I'm confused...
I hope someone can explain this. Any help is much appreciated!
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
Apparently you are very confused! Are you clear on what modulo arithmetic itself is? You say " I don't think on the RHS, b is necessarily a multiple of a". Why would you expect it to be? Saying "ax= b (mod m)" does not imply that b is a multiple of 6. Only that ax-b is a multiple of n. For example, if a= 2, b= 5, and m= 7, ax= b (mod m) becomes 2x= 5 (mod 7). That is satisfied by x= 6 because 2(5)= 12= 5+ 7.
 
kingwinner said:
note: (a,m)=gcd(a,m)

Theorem: ax≡ay (mod m) if and only if x≡y (mod m/(a,m))

And then in the middle of a certain proof later on, my textbook says:
Suppose (a,m)|b.
Then BY THE ABOVE THEOREM(?),
ax≡b (mod m) if and only if (a/(a,m))x ≡ b/(a,m) (mod m/(a,m))?

But I don't see exactly why the above theorem will give us this result.
First of all, I don't think on the RHS, b is necessarily a multiple of a.
Secondly, the theorem says we can divide the LHS and RHS by a (not (a,m)), and divide the modulus by (a,m), NOT a. But in that proof, they divide everything by (a,m) which is not what the theorem says.
Could someone please show me how to apply the theorem in a way that will lead us to this result? I really don't see how...

Is it also true that ax≡ay (mod m) if and only if
(a/(a,m))x ≡ (a/(a,m))y (mod m/(a,m))?

I'm confused...
I hope someone can explain this. Any help is much appreciated!

I think you should be aware that if a = 0 or a factor of m, then you cannot divide a out from the equation ax = ay mod m. For instance 0*5 = 0*7 mod 9 because 5 = 7 mod 1 ,i.e. mod (9/(0,9)) = mod (9/9) = mod 1 but 5 <> 7 mod 9
 
Last edited:
HallsofIvy said:
Apparently you are very confused! Are you clear on what modulo arithmetic itself is? You say " I don't think on the RHS, b is necessarily a multiple of a". Why would you expect it to be? Saying "ax= b (mod m)" does not imply that b is a multiple of 6. Only that ax-b is a multiple of n. For example, if a= 2, b= 5, and m= 7, ax= b (mod m) becomes 2x= 5 (mod 7). That is satisfied by x= 6 because 2(5)= 12= 5+ 7.
I understand what you're saying for sure.

But the theorem says:
ax≡ay (mod m) if and only if x≡y (mod m/(a,m)).

Firstly, our congruence a[/color]x≡b (mod m) here is not of the above form, so why is the theorem even applicable?

Secondly, the theorem doesn't say that we can divide the LHS and RHS and the modulus by (a,m). The theorem says that we can divide the LHS and RHS by "a", and divide the modulus by (a,m).

I hope this clarifies my quesiton.
 
Firstly, our congruence ax≡b (mod m) here is not of the above form

Actually, it is: you just have to write a=\left(a,m\right)\times a/\left(a,m/right) and
b=\left(a,m\right)\times b/\left(a,m/right).

And we may assume that b is divisible by (a,m) because, otherwise, the congruence

ax\equiv b\left({\rm mod}m)

will not have solutions.
 
kingwinner said:
I understand what you're saying for sure.

But the theorem says:
ax≡ay (mod m) if and only if x≡y (mod m/(a,m)).

Firstly, our congruence a[/color]x≡b (mod m) here is not of the above form, so why is the theorem even applicable?
Actually, it is of that form. It's a little confusing because we're using the same variable names for multiple purposes, so let me color them:
ax[/color]=ay[/color] (mod m)
ax[/color]=b[/color] (mod m)​

One way to get a match is by assigning
a[/color] = 1
x[/color] = ax[/color]
y[/color] = b[/color]​


There are lots of trivial modifications you could make to allow you to match the desired form in other ways too.
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
4K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
4K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
4K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
10K
  • · Replies 25 ·
Replies
25
Views
8K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K