Calculating a push force using area, speed, and density?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the force exerted by wind on curtains in a doorway, using parameters such as area, wind speed, and air density. The problem involves concepts from fluid dynamics, particularly Bernoulli's principle and pressure differences.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the application of Bernoulli's equation to determine pressure differences and how these relate to force. There are attempts to rearrange equations and clarify the significance of absolute versus relative pressures.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the problem, offering hints and clarifications regarding the use of pressure differences. Some have expressed confusion about the calculations and the relevance of certain variables, while others have provided guidance on focusing on pressure differences rather than absolute values.

Contextual Notes

There is a noted uncertainty regarding the interpretation of pressure types and the implications of using a change in pressure for calculating force. The discussion reflects a mix of correct and incorrect assumptions about the problem setup.

struggtofunc
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Homework Statement


The doorway in the previous question measures 1.06 m x 2.04 m, and the wind blows parallel to the wall surface at 3.89 m.s-1. Calculate the force pushing the curtains out of the doorway. The density of air is 1.29 kg.m-3.

Known data:
A = (1.06m)(2.04m) = 2.162 m^2
v(wind) = 3.89 ms-1
air density = 1.29 kg.m-3

Homework Equations


F=ma
P=F/A
change in P = (density)(g)(h) ?

The Attempt at a Solution


change in P = (density)(g)(h)
= (1.29) (9.8) (2.04)
= 25.79 Pa

P = F/A
F = PA
= (25.79)(2.1624)
= 55.77 N

I know my method is most likely wrong but I'm not too sure what other equations I could use, especially one that involves the velocity of the wind.
 
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Hint: Bernoulli discovered something about the pressure of moving fluids.
 
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So using Bernoulli's equation:

P1 + (½ * ρ * v1^2) + (½ * ρ * g * h1) = P2 + (½ * ρ * v2^2) + (½ * ρ * g * h2)

Because the wind is flowing parallel, it would be considered horizontal allowing me to cancel out the heights giving me the equation of

P1 + (½ * ρ * v1^2) = P2 + (½ * ρ * v2^2)

Now I'm expecting to be able to calculate P1 and then use F=PA to calculate the final answer (I'm given the area and would calculate P).

However, because this is a before and after type equation, how would I calculate P1 without a value for P2? I am completely stumped. Thanks for your help!
 
You get a pressure difference, that is sufficient. The absolute pressure does not matter (apart from its influence on the density, but that is taken into account already).
 
I'm really sorry but I think I am confusing myself now.

I've rearranged P1 + (½ * ρ * v1^2) = P2 + (½ * ρ * v2^2) to become
P1-P2= ½ * ρ ( v2^2 - V1^2). This would allow me to get a change in pressure.

However, Velocity is not changing so i would be getting a 0 value for v2^2 - V1^2 and wouldn't be able to progress the equation. Am I still on the right track?
 
There is no changing velocity, but there is a different velocity. One velocity is zero, the other is not.
 
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Oh yes, I see. Thankyou very much!

Using that then:

P1-P2= ½ * ρ ( v2^2 - V1^2)
change in pressure = 1/2 (1.29)(3.89^2)
= 9.7602045 Pa.

Am I now right to believe that I can use this value in P=F/A to calculate force?
It is a change in pressure so I'm unsure what 'types' of pressure to use in this calculation and why absolute pressure is not considered.

Edit: My calculations for force using P=F/A gives me an answer of 21.105 N
 
If you have the same pressure on both sides it doesn't influence the door. Only the pressure difference matters.

Looks fine.
 
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Thank you so much! I really appreciate the help :)
 

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