Calculating optical properties of an arbitrary gas?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the optical properties of an arbitrary gas based on its composition, specifically focusing on a hypothetical atmosphere composed of 50% gaseous sulfur and 50% gaseous mercury at elevated temperature and pressure conditions. Participants explore the feasibility of deriving properties such as refractive index and light absorption spectra using basic physical laws and empirical data.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant inquires about the possibility of calculating gas properties solely from its composition, expressing uncertainty about deriving refractive index and light absorption.
  • Another participant suggests that while light absorption spectra can be experimentally verified, they are complex to compute from first principles due to the intricacies of quantum physics, especially for gases beyond helium.
  • A follow-up question seeks clarification on how to compute properties for helium and whether empirical data exists for refractive indices of common gases under varying conditions.
  • Another participant mentions that the refractive index can be inferred from electromagnetic theory and material density, noting that helium has the lowest refractive index among elements and discussing the challenges of predicting spectral absorption beyond hydrogen.
  • It is noted that gases generally have low refractive indices, which vary approximately linearly with pressure, but complications exist in making accurate predictions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the feasibility of calculating optical properties from theoretical principles versus empirical data, indicating a lack of consensus on the methods and complexity involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in computational methods for light absorption and refractive index, particularly the dependence on quantum theories and the availability of empirical data at specific conditions.

Artlav
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Hello.

Is there a way to calculate properties of a gas, given only it's composition?

I.e. let's say i want to know what would a planet look like with an atmosphere of a mix of 50% gaseous sulphur and 50% gaseous mercury, at 500*C and surface pressure of half that of Earth.
How would i go about calculating that just from basic laws?

I kind of know where to start regarding the pressure, density and so on, but i have no idea how to get the refractive index and light absorption by wavelength, for example.

Is it even possible?
If so, what should i look for?
 
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These properties (light absorption spectra ) can be experimentally verified, measured, however it is too complicated to compute from pure physical theories. The theories pertaining to light absorption and so on are quantum physics, which don't permit easy computation - anything beyond a helium atoms is to complex to work out,analytically, only approximately. So we are reduced at this level to empirical study in many respects.
 
Hm, interesting.

Two directions then.

First, how do you compute it for a helium atom, even approximately?
I'm looking for key words.

Second, is there enough empirical data to calculate a refractive index for common gasses at given conditions?
I found data sets online (i.e. http://refractiveindex.info ), but they only show it at or near sea level pressure and temperature.
 
The Refractive index can be inferred from electromagnetic theory, and density of material. I can tell you that Helium has the record lowest refractive index of all the elements. As for spectral absorption which is more important, that may be calculated with perturbation theory in Quantum Physics. I don't know if we can accurately predict much beyond the spectrum of Hydrogen. We can explain a lot of phenomena. Maybe we can, my Quantum understanding is quite limited.

I can also tell you Gold is gold coloured because of relativity http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relativistic_quantum_chemistry#Color_of_gold_and_caesium

You go look on Physical chemistry charts for the spectral absorption.

Gases in general have very low refractive indices, however the refractive index varies approximately linearly with pressure. (n-1 is proportional to pressure) Furthermore, there are many complications. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refractive_index
 

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