Can someone explain this about gradients to me?

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter theneedtoknow
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Explain
Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The discussion clarifies the misconception regarding the operation of the del operator (nabla) in vector calculus, specifically in the context of gradients. The correct interpretation of the expression (A dot Nabla)B is Ax*dBx/dx + Ay*dBx/dy + Az*dBx/dz, rather than the intuitive (dAx/dx + dAy/dy + dAz/dz)Bx. The del operator is not a conventional vector and does not commute with other operations, which is crucial for understanding its application in differential operations.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of vector calculus concepts, particularly gradients and divergence.
  • Familiarity with the del operator (nabla) and its properties.
  • Knowledge of vector functions and their components in three-dimensional space.
  • Basic principles of differential operators and their non-commutative nature.
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the properties of the del operator in vector calculus.
  • Learn about the divergence and curl of vector fields.
  • Explore examples of applying the nabla operator to scalar and vector functions.
  • Investigate the implications of non-commutativity in differential operations.
USEFUL FOR

Students and professionals in mathematics, physics, and engineering who are working with vector calculus and need to clarify the application of the del operator in gradient calculations.

theneedtoknow
Messages
169
Reaction score
0
Say I have two 3d vector functions A and B
I would intuitively think that the xhat component of (A dot Nabla)B

would be
(dAx/dx+dAy/dy+dAz/dz)Bx

but my book gives it as
Ax*dBx/dx + Ay*dBx/dy + Az*dBx/dz

why is this so?
why isn't A dot nabla equal to (dAx/dx+dAy/dy+dAz/dz)?
My book says that the dot product of 2 vectors is commutative, and it says hat although the del operator is not exactly a vector, we can treat it as such in most cases. It never mentions that taking dot products is NOT one of those cases, yet from this it seems that
A dot nabla is NOT equal to nabla dot A

I've been trying to prove the dot product rule for gradients for 2 hours and It is not working out cause I kept doing (A dot nabla)B and (B dot nabla)A the way I thought they should be done, which gives different results from how they are apparently supposed to be done, but the proper way contradicts what I thought I knew about the del operator so clearly I have some kind of misconception that I need straightened out. Thanks!
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The del operator is a derivative operator, so it doesn't necessarily commute with other things. It might help to do an example just with single variables, instead of vectors. Surely you would agree that

f \frac{d}{dx}

and

\frac{d}{dx} f

are two different things, despite the fact that multiplication is generally considered to be commutative. It is the same with the nabla operator, except that it's with the dot product instead of just the ordinary product.

You have to remember that nabla is an operator that acts on whatever appears to its right; so it is not an ordinary vector, even if it might sometimes be written to look like one. Hence

\nabla \cdot \vec A

is the divergence of A, but

\vec A \cdot \nabla

is a differential operator that looks like

A_x \frac{\partial}{\partial x} + A_y \frac{\partial}{\partial y} + A_z \frac{\partial}{\partial z}
 
All is clear now, thank you sir!
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
4K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
4K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 45 ·
2
Replies
45
Views
6K
  • · Replies 30 ·
2
Replies
30
Views
4K
  • · Replies 38 ·
2
Replies
38
Views
7K