Characteristic/Minimal polynomials - Linear Algebra question

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around finding characteristic and minimal polynomials for a given 3x3 matrix. The original poster presents a matrix and seeks to determine polynomials that satisfy a specific equation involving the characteristic polynomial.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the characteristic polynomial and its relationship to the minimal polynomial, with some questioning the original poster's understanding of these concepts. There is mention of using the Euclidean algorithm to find polynomials that satisfy the given equation.

Discussion Status

The conversation includes attempts to clarify the process of finding the minimal polynomial and the use of the Euclidean algorithm. Some participants provide examples and analogies to aid understanding, while others express uncertainty about the original poster's approach.

Contextual Notes

There is ambiguity in the original poster's statements regarding their understanding of the characteristic polynomial. The discussion also touches on the application of the Euclidean algorithm to polynomials, with references to external resources for further clarification.

Locoism
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Homework Statement


Given the matrix:

0 1 0
0 0 1
12 8 -1

(sorry I don't know how to put proper matrix format)

a) find polynomials a(λ)(λ+2)2+b(λ)(λ-3) = 1 (where a(λ) and b(λ) are the polynomials)


The Attempt at a Solution



Well the characteristic polynomial is already given, but can easily be found, as
(λ+2)2(λ-3)
but how do I find such polynomials? Is this what is meant by the minimal polynomial?
 
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Locoism said:

Homework Statement


Given the matrix:

0 1 0
0 0 1
12 8 -1

(sorry I don't know how to put proper matrix format)

a) find polynomials a(λ)(λ+2)2+b(λ)(λ-3) = 1 (where a(λ) and b(λ) are the polynomials)


The Attempt at a Solution



Well the characteristic polynomial is already given, but can easily be found, as
(λ+2)2(λ-3)
but how do I find such polynomials? Is this what is meant by the minimal polynomial?

I don't understand. First you say that the characteristic polynomial "can easily be found, as (x+2)^2 *(x-3)" [using 'x' instead of 'lambda'], but then you say "but how do I find such polynomials?". So, do you, or do you not know how to find the characteristic polynomial?

As to minimal polynomial: well, it is a theorem that a matrix satisfies its own characteristic polynomial. For you matrix A the characteristic polynomial is C(x) = x^3 + x^2 - 8x - 12, so A satisfies A^3 + A^2 - 8A - 12I (where I = 3x3 identity matrix). In other words, the polynomial C "annihilates" A: C(A) = 0. The minimal polynomial of A is the polynomial of least degree that annihilates A (and has leading coefficient = 1). Sometimes the characteristic polynomial is the minimal polynomial, and sometimes not. For example, the 3x3 identity matrix I = [[1 0 0],[0 1 0], [0 0 1]] has characteristic polynomial C(x) = x^3 - 1, but has minimal polynomial x-1 (because A - 1*I = 0 when A = I).

One algorithm to find the minimal polynomial is that used by Maple: regard I, A, A^2 and A^3 as 9-dimensional vectors, obtained by writing the rows side-by side (so A <--> [0 1 0 0 0 1 12 8 -1], etc.). The fact that A satisfies the characteristic polynomial means that A^3 is a linear combination of I, A and A^2 with known coefficients. By doing linear algebra row operations, we can find the smallest number of rows among I, A, A^2 and A^3 such that A^k is a linear combination of I, A,..., A^(k-1), and that linear combination gives the minimal polynomial.

RGV
 
Ray Vickson said:
I don't understand. First you say that the characteristic polynomial "can easily be found, as (x+2)^2 *(x-3)" [using 'x' instead of 'lambda'], but then you say "but how do I find such polynomials?". So, do you, or do you not know how to find the characteristic polynomial?

I think Locoism was referring to part a):
a) find polynomials a(λ)(λ+2)2+b(λ)(λ-3) = 1 (where a(λ) and b(λ) are the polynomials)

These can be found using the Euclidean algorithm: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euclidean_algorithm#Polynomials.
 
Yes, sorry that was a little ambiguous.
Thank you very much spamiam, if I understand correctly, I just need to apply the algorithm to find the gcd of (x+2)^2 and (x-3)?
 
Well, you're actually using the Euclidean algorithm followed by reverse substitution. I probably should have given you http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_Euclidean_algorithm" link instead. For simplicity, I'll give you an example using integers instead of polynomials.

Consider 7 and 19. They are relatively prime, so gcd(7,19)=1. By http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B%C3%A9zout%27s_identity" there are integers a and b such that 7a + 19b = 1. Using the Euclidean algorithm, we get

19=2(7) +5
7=1(5) +2
5=2(2)+1

Solving these equations for the remainders, we have

1=5-2(2)
2=7-5
5=19-2(7)

giving us
<br /> 1=5-2 \cdot 2 = 5-2(7-5)=3 \cdot 5 - 2 \cdot 7 = 3(19-2 \cdot 7) -2 \cdot 7 = 3\cdot 19 -8 \cdot 7 \, .<br />
The process is analogous for polynomials, I believe.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Thank you so much!
Ok so I end up with a(λ) = 1/25 and b(λ) = -1/25(λ-7) (it works out)
So if I use these with the matrix A as in
E1 = 1/25(A+2)2
E2 = -1/25(A-7)(A-3)
and I want to calculate the Kernel, would that just be (A-3) and (A+2)2 respectively seeing as E1*E2 = 0? And then ImageE1 would just be KernelE2 and vice-versa?
 
I'm not quite sure I follow... Typically you just need to set up E_1 x = 0 and solve for x to compute the kernel. What is the question you're trying to answer?
 

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