Dimension of the group O(n,R) - How to calc?

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion focuses on determining the dimension of the orthogonal group O(n,R) and the number of parameters required to define an orthogonal transformation in Rn. Participants explore various approaches, including algebraic constraints and geometric reasoning.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the dimension of O(n,R) corresponds to the number of parameters needed for orthogonal transformations, initially proposing n(n+1)/2 free components.
  • Another participant calculates the constraints imposed by the orthogonality condition (AA^T = I), concluding that the dimension is n(n-1)/2 based on the number of independent constraints.
  • A later reply reiterates the same calculation regarding constraints and freedom, affirming the dimension as n(n-1)/2.
  • Another participant introduces an inductive approach, suggesting that the dimension can also be derived by considering the selection of orthogonal unit vectors and proposing a formula that adds n to the previous dimension for n space.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants present differing methods to arrive at the dimension of O(n,R), with some agreeing on the algebraic approach yielding n(n-1)/2, while another proposes an inductive geometric method leading to a different expression. No consensus is reached on a single definitive dimension.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes various assumptions about the nature of orthogonal transformations and the constraints involved. The reliance on different mathematical approaches may lead to varying interpretations of the dimension.

JuanC97
Messages
48
Reaction score
0
Hi, I want to find the number of parameters needed to define an orthogonal transformation in Rn.
As I suppose, this equals the dimension of the orthogonal group O(n,R) - but, correct me if I'm wrong.

I haven't been able to figure out how to do this yet. If it helps, I know that an orthogonal matix should have n(n+1)/2 "free components".
That said, I'd appreciate any hint from this point.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
An orthogonal tranformation ##A## satisfies ##AA^T = I##. Those are initially ##n^2## constraints, but some coincide since the matrix ##AA^T## always is symmetric even if the matrix is orthogonal. So the amount of constraints consist of an upper diagonal matrix, which has ##\frac{n(n+1)}{2}## entries.

The amount of freedom is then ##n^2 - \frac{n(n+1)}{2} = \frac{n(n-1)}{2}##, which is the dimension.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: JuanC97
micromass said:
An orthogonal tranformation ##A## satisfies ##AA^T = I##. Those are initially ##n^2## constraints, but some coincide since the matrix ##AA^T## always is symmetric even if the matrix is orthogonal. So the amount of constraints consist of an upper diagonal matrix, which has ##\frac{n(n+1)}{2}## entries.

The amount of freedom is then ##n^2 - \frac{n(n+1)}{2} = \frac{n(n-1)}{2}##, which is the dimension.

Thanks, very concise.
 
you can also use induction and geometry. such a matrix consists of n orthogonal unit length columns. so just ask how many ways there are to choose these. If n = 1, only two choices exist of unit vectors, so the dimension is zero. then to go from n to n+1, we begin by choosing a unit vector in n+1 space, i.e. a point on the n dimensional sphere in n+1 space. so the inductive step giving the answer fore n+1 space, just adds n to the answer for n space, so just add n to n(n-1)/2 and you get (n+1)n/2.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: jim mcnamara

Similar threads

  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
4K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
7K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K