Does Light Exert a Force on Lasers?

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    Force Lasers Light
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around whether light exerts a force on lasers, particularly focusing on the implications of photon momentum and the conservation of momentum. Participants explore concepts related to relativity, energy, and experimental evidence in physics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions if photons exert a backward force on a laser, suggesting a connection to energy conservation and relativity.
  • Another participant asserts that there is indeed a backward force related to momentum conservation, independent of relativity.
  • A request for equations related to photon momentum is made, indicating interest in the mathematical framework.
  • A participant provides the equation relating energy and momentum for a single photon, stating E = Pc = hf.
  • One participant speculates about the effects of moving with a laser or flashlight on battery drain time, referencing time dilation.
  • Another participant emphasizes that photon emission and absorption involve recoil, citing experiments such as the Mossbauer effect as evidence.
  • A similar point about battery drain time is reiterated, noting that the time remains consistent for the person holding the flashlight due to their frame of reference.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between light, force, and momentum. While some agree on the existence of a backward force due to momentum conservation, others introduce complexities related to relativity and frame of reference, indicating that the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various concepts such as time dilation and the Mossbauer effect without fully resolving the implications of these ideas on the original question. The discussion includes assumptions about the behavior of light and the effects of motion that are not fully explored.

bassplayer142
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Say you shoot a beam of light in a laser or flashlight. Does the photons exert a backwards force on the laser. I understand how some of Einsteins relativity works out on the train with adding velocities and all. It just makes sense that energy is being lost by not adding velocities so the energy has to go somewhere. Maybe I don't have a full understanding of relativity.
 
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Yes there is a backward force.
This is not directly related to relativity.
It is related to momentum conservation.
Momentum conservation is related to the absence of force of the system {laser+photon}.
 
Do they have equations for this?
 
For a single photon of light
E = Pc = hf

where
E is energy
P is momentum
c is the speed of light
h is Planck's constant
and f is the frequency
 
So if you were to take a laser or flashlight and move faster then the amount of time until the battery drained would differ from someone who is not moving. I'm guess the time would be the same as time dilation would suggest.
 
Just remember that whan a photon is emitted there is a recoil.
Similarly when a photon is absorbed.
There are numerous experiments that illustrate that in physics laboratories.
One of these experiments is called the Mossbauer effect, was worth a Nobel price.

All these experiments are very far from the complicated batery thing that you suggest but they are quite astonishig.
 
bassplayer142 said:
So if you were to take a laser or flashlight and move faster then the amount of time until the battery drained would differ from someone who is not moving.
You are always stationary in your own frame of reference and the speed of light is always the speed of light, so the time it takes to drain the batteries is always the same for the person holdiing the flashlight.
 

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