Does relativity affect velocity dependent events?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the effects of relativity on electromagnetic fields, specifically in the context of moving charged particles and their interactions with observers in different reference frames. Participants explore the implications of relative motion on the perception of electric and magnetic fields as described by Maxwell's equations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that an electron moving quickly creates a magnetic field around it, but questions how this field is perceived by another particle moving at the same speed.
  • Another participant argues that the electromagnetic field should be viewed as a unified entity, with the decomposition into electric and magnetic components depending on the observer's frame of reference.
  • A later reply confirms that from the perspective of a particle moving alongside the electron, no magnetic field is created, while an observer on the sidewalk perceives both electric and magnetic fields that vary over time.
  • It is noted that the presence of an electric field is necessary due to the proximity of a stationary charged electron, even if the magnetic field is not perceived by the moving particle.
  • Participants emphasize that understanding these phenomena is clearer when considering the electromagnetic field as a single tensor rather than separate electric and magnetic fields.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the importance of the frame of reference in understanding electromagnetic fields, but there are nuances in how they interpret the implications of these fields for different observers. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best conceptual framework for understanding these interactions.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the complexity of electromagnetic field interactions and the potential for conceptual misunderstandings when using traditional language of induction in electrodynamics. There are also assumptions about the nature of fields that may not be explicitly stated.

Wittyname6
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I've heard that a changing magnetic field creates an electric field and vice versa. So if shoot an electron in a straight line, it would create a magnetic field in a circle around it.

Let's say the electron is moving quickly down a road. But there is another particle moving exactly the same speed as the electron beside it. Relative to this particle, the electron is not moving at all, but relative to an observer on the road, it is moving very quickly. Would this not mean that from the particles perspective, there is no field being created, and the observer on the sidewalk experiences some sort of field?
 
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Yes. But the better way to think about it is that there is just an electromagnetic field. How we decompose this electromagnetic field into an electric part and a magnetic part depends on the frame of reference.

The usual notion of time-varying electric fields "inducing" rotational magnetic fields and time-varying magnetic fields "inducing" rotational electric fields often leads to conceptual issues (or even conceptual breakthroughs) for people first learning electrodynamics simply because the "induction" language works in an approximate framework. See for example this recent thread: https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=759414
 
Wittyname6 said:
Would this not mean that from the particles perspective, there is no field being created, and the observer on the sidewalk experiences some sort of field?
You have reasoned exactly correctly. As WBN mentioned, the "cleanest" way of looking at Maxwell's equations is not in terms of separate vector electric and magnetic fields, but rather in terms of a single tensor electromagnetic field.
 
Wittyname6 said:
Let's say the electron is moving quickly down a road. But there is another particle moving exactly the same speed as the electron beside it. Relative to this particle, the electron is not moving at all, but relative to an observer on the road, it is moving very quickly. Would this not mean that from the particles perspective, there is no field being created, and the observer on the sidewalk experiences some sort of field?

From the particle's perspective, there is no magnetic field. There is still an electrical field; there has to be because the particle is sitting right next to a stationary charged electron, and that charge has to create an electrical field.

The sidewalk observer experiences both a magnetic and an electric field, both varying with time as the electron moves closer, passes, starts to move away, and eventually recedes to infinity.

As others have already pointed out, this whole problem is easier to solve if you think in terms of a single electromagnetic field instead of separate electrical and magnetic fields.
 

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