Does the size of a magnet affect its range?

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    Magnet Range
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the question of whether the size of a magnet affects its range and how factors such as vacuum conditions influence magnetic interactions. Participants explore concepts related to magnetic fields, their propagation, and potential experimental setups to investigate these ideas.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Experimental/applied

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants wonder if the size of a magnet or the presence of a vacuum affects the range of its magnetic field.
  • There are claims that magnets influence each other immediately, raising questions about the nature of magnetic field propagation and the speed of light.
  • One participant suggests that when two magnets interact, they create a new wave function, implying that the field changes rather than spreads.
  • Another participant questions the apparent contradiction between immediate influence and the propagation speed of magnetic field changes.
  • Participants propose various experimental setups, such as connecting magnets to a rotary axis to test communication systems based on magnetic interactions.
  • There is discussion about the concept of "Signal to Noise Ratio" in communication systems and how proximity affects the influence between magnets.
  • Some participants express confusion about the nature of magnetic influence, with one suggesting that all magnets might have a small influence on each other.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the nature of magnetic influence and the implications of size and distance on magnetic interactions. The discussion remains unresolved, with no consensus on the effects of magnet size or the immediate influence of magnets on each other.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding assumptions about magnetic field behavior, the definitions of influence, and the conditions under which these interactions are considered. Some mathematical and conceptual steps remain unresolved.

  • #31
So i am a litle confuse i will send a draw please tell me if it allow communication faster then the light
 
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  • #32
danielhaish said:
So i am a litle confuse i will send a draw please tell me if it allow communication faster then the light
No. There is no such thing as communication faster than light speed.
 
  • #33
phinds said:
No. There is no such thing as communication faster than light speed.
This is the sipmle version of my system for a short dectance
 

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  • #34
Is it going to work
 
  • #35
danielhaish said:
Is it going to work

No. Because..

phinds said:
There is no such thing as communication faster than light speed.
 
  • #36
danielhaish said:
This is the sipmle version of my system for a short dectance
How do you plan to clock this communication system? Is it based on precise clocks at each end (like RS-232), or will you embed a clock in your communication channel like in Differential Manchester Coded communications?

Google each of those if you don't understand my question, and after you have done that reading, feel free to post your questions about that reading here if you don't understand the concept of clocking in communication. :smile:
 
  • #37
I do understand every signal will close elctrical syrcal by the movment of the the magnet and i going to use the simple binary packet protocol of compiters
 
  • #38
danielhaish said:
I do understand every signal will close elctrical syrcal by the movment of the the magnet and i going to use the simple binary packet protocol of compiters
PF AI Translation gives:

"I do understand that every signal will close electrical Southern California by the movement of the magnet, and I am going to use the simple binary packet protocol of computers."

I don't understand the Southern California reference, but whatever. Computers use synchronous signalling where a clock accompanies the data. So you will have to say how you plan to send the clock signal with your magnets in addition to the data signal. Will you use two Tx magnets and two Rx magnets to send the data and clock?
 
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  • #39
It going to have time counter between two signal if the time between the signal is small so it 0 if is biger then it 1 like morc code
 
  • #40
danielhaish said:
like morc code
So the code will rely on a recovered clock, based on the width of the symbol. That's fine. It's not how you transmit the fastest data, but Morse code is not aimed at fast data transmission. It is aimed at reliable data transmission at human speeds.

Anyway, I think your main question is about using flipping magnetic fields to transmit data. You can do that, but it is far from the best way to do it. Have you tried building this experiment yet?
 
  • #41
No i just was wondering if it possible
 
  • #42
danielhaish said:
No i just was wondering if it possible
It is possible for short distances, but there are much better ways to communicate data wirelessly over longer distances. Can you guess at a few of those better ways? :smile:
 
  • #43
Yap Voice waves like radio ,radiation,light, i think that i know how to use this idea for longer distance but i don't really want to tell
 
  • #44
danielhaish said:
i think that i know how to use this idea for longer distance but i don't really want to tell
Please read through this useful reference in case it helps. Let us know if you have questions about this reading. :smile:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communication_theory
 
  • #46
danielhaish said:
I am typing on a phone is it worng?
Even if you type on a phone, there is no reason not to check what you have typed. If you want the best from PF then you need to make a bit more effort, I think.
 
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  • #47
danielhaish said:
I meaned that I wll use two magnets that and one of them will be connect to rotary axis and for send the signal you will flip the magnet and them instad of pulling the other magnet it will push to other magnet so when the two magnet will be on the same pole the signal will be 1 and if the two magnet will be on different poles the signal will be0
This is a fair, valid experiment. But once you are transferring Energy from one magnet to the other, you have evidence that an EM wave has been launched (fields changing with time) and there will also be Electric Fields involved. A magnet rotating at high enough speed will radiate a wave that is indistinguishable by a distant receiver+antenna from the wave transmitted from a conventional RF transmitter.

As mentioned above, the effect can only be measured if the S/N ratio is high enough. Doing the experiment 'mechanically' would be very challenging. Along the lines of detecting gravity waves.
 
  • #48
I don't have to connect it to actuall computer i can connect it to led or something , this is also can be useful as wireless charging
 
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  • #49
danielhaish said:
I don't have to connect it to actull computer i can connect it to led or somwthing , this is also can be useful as wireless charging
Would you PLEASE start checking your spelling? This has gotten ridiculous. Your incredible sloppiness in posting has been mentioned several times in this thread. Please pay attention and do something about it. Do not hit "post reply" until you have checked your spelling. Thank you.
 
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  • #50
danielhaish said:
this is also can be useful as wireless charging
Wireless charging involves the transfer of serious amounts of Power (say a Watt minimum). This would not be practicable with your proposed mechanical system, which would involve microWatt levels. Two different extremes of the same phenomenon.
'Wireless' charging is best described as 'Non-contact' charging. i.e. the device is laid on the dock without being explicitly plugged in. A Power oscillator and two close coupled coils are involved.
 

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