Driven simple pendulum - system of first order ODEs

AI Thread Summary
The discussion revolves around converting a driven pendulum's second-order differential equation into a system of first-order equations. The user proposes using a dummy variable, y, to express the system, defining dθ/dt as y and dy/dt in terms of θ and time. There is a challenge in expressing the equations solely in terms of a dimensionless variable x, which is defined as ωt, due to the requirement for plotting θ against dθ/dx later. The conversation highlights the necessity of maintaining consistent notation and the limitations of numerical solutions in Python. Ultimately, the user concludes that substituting dx = ωdt may be a viable approach to address the problem.
Edge Of Pain
Messages
21
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement



We have a driven pendulum described by the following differential equation:

\frac{d^2\theta}{dt^2} = \frac{-g}{l}\sin(\theta) + C\cos(\theta)\sin(\Omega t)

I need to turn this second order differential equation into a system of first order differential equations (then use a computer to solve the first orders, but that's not the problem here).

Homework Equations



None needed

The Attempt at a Solution


[/B]
We are told to use some numeric values: l = 10cm, g = 9.81m/s^2, capital omega = 5/s, C = 2/s^2, and we are told to turn the equation into a dimensionless equation using the following notation:

\omega^2 = g/l

\beta = \frac{\Omega}{\omega}

\gamma = \frac{C}{\omega}

x= \omega t

Now, putting these into the ODE gives

\frac{d^2\theta}{dt^2} = \omega^2\sin(\theta) + \omega^2\gamma\cos(\theta)\sin(\beta x)

But, the only way I can think of turning this into a system of first order ODEs is by using some dummy variable, y.

In other words, let

\frac{d\theta}{dt} = y

and

\frac{dy}{dt} = \omega^2\sin(\theta) + \omega^2\gamma\cos(\theta)\sin(\beta x)

Is there no way to get it all in terms of theta and x?

EDIT:
I accidentally posted this before it was complete because I hit the "enter" key. Is there a way to turn this feature off? I don't want to get into trouble over posting something which doesn't fit with the rules.
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
What do you mean? You had it as a system including only theta and t and you rewrite it as a system of two first order equations. That necessarily has to involve another dependent variable, one you decided to call y. It is unclear why you introduce x unless you want a dimensionless number, but then you should replace all occurences of t with x and not mix the notation.
 
  • Like
Likes Edge Of Pain
Orodruin said:
What do you mean? You had it as a system including only theta and t and you rewrite it as a system of two first order equations. That necessarily has to involve another dependent variable, one you decided to call y. It is unclear why you introduce x unless you want a dimensionless number, but then you should replace all occurences of t with x and not mix the notation.

Yeah, my thinking is the same and I think I just need to leave it at that (besides, numerically solving that system results in a graph which looks sensible).

But there is a reason why I need it in terms of x - a later part of the question is that it asks for a plot of theta against \frac{d\theta}{dx}, but the solution is for theta as a function of time. Also, it's a numerical solution - I don't actually know what theta is in analytical form so I can't just differentiate it with respect to x by hand.

My thinking is this:
I have the quantity x = omega * t. What If I just do dx = \omega dt, giving \frac{1}{\omega} dx = dt and just substitute that into the system? I'm going to try that now.
 
Last edited:
Have you heard of the chain rule?
 
Orodruin said:
Have you heard of the chain rule?

Yes.

Also I tried to solve this entirely in terms of theta and x, as I said I would above, but it was pointless since the only way to get Python to numerically solve this is to tell it that x is defined as omega * t, then give t values. So obviously it gave the same thing.
 
Thread 'Collision of a bullet on a rod-string system: query'
In this question, I have a question. I am NOT trying to solve it, but it is just a conceptual question. Consider the point on the rod, which connects the string and the rod. My question: just before and after the collision, is ANGULAR momentum CONSERVED about this point? Lets call the point which connects the string and rod as P. Why am I asking this? : it is clear from the scenario that the point of concern, which connects the string and the rod, moves in a circular path due to the string...
Back
Top