Effect of dissociation energy on plasma ions behavior

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the effects of dissociation energy and ionization energy on the behavior of plasma ions in different gases, specifically comparing oxygen and nitrogen. Participants explore theoretical implications regarding energy levels, discharge currents, and the relationship between dissociation energy and ionization potential in plasma contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether higher dissociation energy in nitrogen compared to oxygen leads to more energetic nitrogen ions or higher average discharge currents.
  • Another participant argues that dissociation energy relates to atomic binding strength and does not directly correlate with ionization potential.
  • A later reply acknowledges that nitrogen has a higher first ionization energy than oxygen and questions if this implies higher energy for electrons and ions in nitrogen plasma.
  • Another participant challenges the idea that higher ionization energy necessarily means higher kinetic energy or temperature in the plasma, suggesting that it may indicate a higher latent heat for plasma formation instead.
  • They provide an analogy comparing the vaporization of water and ether to illustrate how energy distribution during phase transitions may differ based on latent heat.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of dissociation and ionization energies, with no consensus reached on how these factors affect the energy of plasma ions or discharge currents.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that assumptions about heat capacities and other thermodynamic properties may influence their arguments, but these factors remain unresolved within the discussion.

Si14
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Hi,
Suppose there are two plasma cases, conditions are the same, except for the gases present:
a-Oxygen
b-Nitrogen

Since the dissociation energy of nitrogen is higher than oxygen, what could be concluded from it? Could it be more energetic nitrogen ions than oxygen ions (because initially they needed more energy to dissociate?) or something else? Or could it be concluded that the average discharge current in case b is higher than case a because of this?

Thanks.
 
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I don't think you can say much. The dissociation energy only tells you how strongly one atom binds to another; which doesn't have any direct relationship to the ionization potential.

If you look at it in terms of electronic levels, then the binding/dissociation energy corresponds to the relative shift in the occupied levels when two atoms get close to each other, whereas the ionization potential is their absolute value.
 
Thanks. Ok, I also know that the 1st ionization energy of nitrogen is higher than oxygen.
http://environmentalchemistry.com/yogi/periodic/1stionization.html

So knowing this, can I argue what I said in my 1st post that since the ionization energy is higher for nitrogen, compared to oxygen, can one say that the energy of electrons and ions in the nitrogen plasma is higher than the oxygen plasma?
On the other hand, since plasma deals with the ionization energy, I assume, then what can be concluded from higher ionization energy level of nitrogen compared to oxygen?
 
Si14 said:
So knowing this, can I argue what I said in my 1st post that since the ionization energy is higher for nitrogen, compared to oxygen, can one say that the energy of electrons and ions in the nitrogen plasma is higher than the oxygen plasma? On the other hand, since plasma deals with the ionization energy, I assume, then what can be concluded from higher ionization energy level of nitrogen compared to oxygen?

You can't say the energy of the electrons and ions in the plasma would be higher; what that means to me would be saying that their kinetic energy is higher, i.e. a higher temperature. The thermodynamics of phase changes works just as well for plasma as any other. Basically the ionization energy represents part of the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latent_heat" for the phase transition from gas to plasma. Let's assume all else is equal (heat capacities and such), and assume a higher ionization potential means a higher latent heat (it probably does in almost all cases, but properly there's there's entropy to take into account), also meaning a higher temperature is required to form a plasma.

If you then consider a given amount of nitrogen and the same amount of oxygen at some temperature, and add the same amount of energy (enough to create plasmas) to both, then the oxygen plasma will be hotter, because less energy was spent turning it into a plasma. A direct analogy to a more conventional phase change would be if you took a given amount of water and ether and vaporized them with the same amount of energy (where we again, for the sake of argument assume equal heat capacities). Ether has a much lower latent heat of vaporization compared to water (because its intermolecular bonds are much weaker), so more energy would be 'left over' for heating it, and the ether vapor would be hotter than the water vapor.
 
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