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ryan albery
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I'm wondering who out there believes a Higgs field exists, and why you do/don't believe that? It seems like an aether theory to me...
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The whole theory behind it, mass generation with a φ4 sym-ryan albery said:I'm wondering who out there believes a Higgs field exists, and why do you believe that? It seems like an aether theory to me...
ryan albery said:I'm wondering who out there believes a Higgs field exists, and why you do/don't believe that? It seems like an aether theory to me...
ryan albery said:I'm wondering who out there believes a Higgs field exists, and why you do/don't believe that? It seems like an aether theory to me...
ApplePion said:When particle theories do not work--e.g. the Weinberg Salam Glashow theory yields totally wrong results for masses-- instead of admitting error, the perpetrators just pretend that imaginary "Higgs bosons" are doing their thing.
I think you acutely misunderstand the GWS theory, and perhaps much of gauge theory in general. Gauge and fermion mass terms violate the local symmetries believed to generate the fundamental interactions. Spontaneous symmetry breaking, in the form of the Higgs-Kibble mechanism, is one way of generating masses while retaining these vital symmetries. SSB was not invented to fudge erroneous predictions of the GWS theory.ApplePion said:When particle theories do not work--e.g. the Weinberg Salam Glashow theory yields totally wrong results for masses-- instead of admitting error, the perpetrators just pretend that imaginary "Higgs bosons" are doing their thing. Higgs bosons were also introduced to rationalize incorrect theories of cosmological inflation.
ApplePion said:The post-result addition of the mystical Higgs thing is not the result of the direct theory, but rather was added AFTERWARDS, right?
bapowell said:It is quite possible that the Higgs mechanism is not afterall relevant to particle physics, but then gauge theory itself, which has proven extremely successful (QED, GWS, QCD) is in dire straights.
ApplePion said:Did not the papers yield a result that electrons have no masses?
My understanding is that is the actual result.
The post-result addition of the mystical Higgs thing is not the result of the direct theory, but rather was added AFTERWARDS, right?
Am I incorrect about something I just wrote?
ryan albery said:I'm wondering who out there believes a Higgs field exists, and why you do/don't believe that? It seems like an aether theory to me...
Epaminondas said:I agree that Higgs mechanism was added afterwards
Vanadium 50 said:Did you read the original papers? I don't understand why people keep saying this.
Vanadium 50 said:The paper that predicts the W and Z is Weinberg's "A Model Of Leptons" (1967), Weinberg doesn't get all the details right, but in this paper he invents a W and Z and uses the Higgs mechanism (reference 3) to give the leptons and W,Z bosons mass.
Vanadium 50 said:You can have Technicolor, for example.
ApplePion said:What happens if the Higgs boson is not found in the supercollider experiments? Will you think it does not exist? If so, you will be in the position of adamently defending the Weinberg et al theory that will have turned out to have been wrong.
ApplePion said:I don't think that the people who believe in the Higgs bosons are going to be convinced by the arguments I am making here.
But I would be interested in your responses to a question I asked earlier (but was not responded to). What if the supercollider does not find the supposed Higgs boson? It was touted to find it.
So what would happen? Would you agree it likely does not exist?
Would you reconsider whether your ability to decide things based on your aesthetic intuition is as good as you assumed?
I suspect that experimental reality will not make much of a dent, at least in the near term. In particle physics it seems to me that wrong theories are often not realized as wrong--just patched up to become more complicated wrong theories in need of more patching.
So again, my question is "Would you abandon the Higgs boson theory if the supercollider does not find it?"
The Higgs field is a theoretical field that permeates the entire universe and is responsible for giving particles their mass. It is important in particle physics because it helps to explain why some particles have mass while others do not, and it is a crucial component in the Standard Model of particle physics.
The existence of the Higgs field was first proposed by physicist Peter Higgs in the 1960s as a way to explain the origin of mass in particles. It has since been confirmed through experiments at the Large Hadron Collider (LHC) in 2012, where scientists observed the Higgs boson, the particle associated with the Higgs field.
One of the main debates surrounding the Higgs field is its role in the hierarchy problem, which questions why the Higgs field has such a low mass compared to other particles in the Standard Model. There is also ongoing research and debate about the nature of the Higgs boson and its interactions with other particles.
The existence of the Higgs field has greatly impacted our understanding of the universe, as it helps to explain the fundamental building blocks of matter and the origin of mass. It also plays a crucial role in the Standard Model of particle physics, which is our current best explanation of the fundamental forces and particles in the universe.
Further research on the Higgs field could lead to a better understanding of the fundamental forces in the universe and potentially unlock new discoveries in particle physics. It could also help to shed light on unanswered questions such as the origin of dark matter and the unification of all fundamental forces. Additionally, this research could have practical applications in fields such as technology and medicine.