Father puts .45 rounds into teenage girl's laptop

[nitsuj]

Not specific to their relationship, but a general comment of the info provided

People come into the world free of things like "being a spoilled brat".

(assuming) on one hand the farther has raised the child with this trait, while on the other he tries to resolve it by shooting her goods.

If she doesn't see the distinction between, "dad bought it, so it's really his" and "dad bought, but it's really mine" that's his crime, but apparently her punishment.

With that being said, this is a cruicial time (developent, brain "setting in it's ways") in her life, and if this incident has made significant impact in this sense, he may have just layered another issue ontop of the entitlement issue/reinforced that issue.

Oh and if this is actually made a big deal in their family, then perhaps it is all fitting.

 

[jim hardy]

i grew up in a family where much communication was almost subliminal
there was so much you just couldn't say

and i was amazed at how some families used hollering and arm-waving that terrified me but was normal to them.

What's healthier?
Who am i to say?

 

[chaoseverlasting]

Can you imagine the frustration of a father who's probably tried most of the things so far suggested under the ambit of 'good parenting' but still has to live with and love and try to positively influence his kid?

I have very little experience in trying to get people to do things for themselves (think group assignments), but even I've realized how frustratingly difficult it is to get someone to listen to you about something and then act upon it even when they agree with it or already know it.

In a group of 8, maybe 5 work in good groups... Not for the lack of trying different methods, not because it doesn't hurt them; it does. For some reason, it is very difficult to lead people. The guy is human; he lost patience.

 

[Pythagorean]

Can you imagine the frustration of a father who's probably tried most of the things so far suggested under the ambit of 'good parenting' but still has to live with and love and try to positively influence his kid?

Yep, I'm a father of two. They're not teens yet, but I can definitely imagine frustration...

I have very little experience in trying to get people to do things for themselves (think group assignments), but even I've realized how frustratingly difficult it is to get someone to listen to you about something and then act upon it even when they agree with it or already know it.

And the lesson to our children is that you can't force people to do things and you can't force people to listen (except for maybe putting a gun to their head, or brandishing a gun). And you especially don't start shooting things when you're not getting your way. That's what you should strive to show by example.

In a group of 8, maybe 5 work in good groups... Not for the lack of trying different methods, not because it doesn't hurt them; it does. For some reason, it is very difficult to lead people. The guy is human; he lost patience.

Yes, and his behavior shouldn't be excused; we don't justify behavior as a mistake, we try to correct it as a society, by saying "this is the wrong thing to do". Though he should be forgiven after he admits he did the wrong thing.

 

[nitsuj]

Can you imagine the frustration of a father who's probably tried most of the things so far suggested under the ambit of 'good parenting' but still has to live with and love and try to positively influence his kid?

I can't even remotely imagine what it would be like. I can imagine myself at 15. Very very rebellious, with father "away" there was no "ultimate" threat, since I was physically bigger then my mother.

My mother would "talk" with me if I was in trouble. And to some degree I absorbed the "lesson".

It was when i was 15, I can distinctly remember getting into trouble again, heading home for the "talk". To my surprise, my mother said something along the lines of, "I've talked enough, you've heard enough, these are your choices and I am disappointed." The tone and facial expression was perfect, I felt every ounce of guilt I earned. I matured a few years that day.

Only if every ones mom was so smart.

 

[netgypsy]

Many a time I felt like throwing my computer in the lake due to various malfunctions. I'm sure you guys remember fighting with DOS and on up every time you added something, every time you upgraded something and just for no reason it all - BSOD AAARRRGGG But I can't imagine shooting my kids laptop. It would just get locked up When he was a little kid and thought the floor was where all his clothes and toys went I bagged them up and hid the bags for a month. He's a lot neater than I am now. Having had a child who had no response whatsoever to punishment like spanking I got really good at making the punishment fit the crime. Computers were always in the main living room where all content was visible and spending too long on a game or whatever, meant it got unplugged or battery removed.

Since I've lived 4 miles from western NC I can reaffirm the love of firearms in that area. That's bootleg country too. The Rudolph guy who set off the bomb in Olympic park in Atlanta and killed a lady right next to her child hid out in that area for a long time. Very clannish to say the least.

 

[Jasongreat]

Father demonstrated lack of emotional inhibition because his feelings were hurt. He did so with a gun. Bad role model.

Father pre meditated what was about to happen, he warned daughter that if she used her computer to diss him publicly she would lose said computer. She did exactly what he warned against, he did exactly what he said he would do, where is the emotional inhibition here? I thought the whole point of pre- meditated versus a crime of passion insinuates that if one thinks about it first it is no longer a crime of passion(emotional inhibition). It seems to me the whole argument against him is that he used a gun, would he still be wrong if he used a bat to destroy computer? how bout a knife? what if he donated it to charity? She still wouldn't have use of said computer, why is he wrong just because he used a gun?

 

[feathermoon]

Guns kill people (who don't respect them).

Just from watching him trip over words in the video its clear he rehearsed it in his mind, no question of premeditation there.

 

[Jasongreat]

Guns kill people (who don't respect them).

Just from watching him trip over words in the video its clear he rehearsed it in his mind, no question of premeditation there.

If you read the interview, previously in this thread, you will see that she was warned. Being warned suggests pre-meditation, pre-meditation goes against emotional inhibition.

And guns don't kill people, people kill people. But I do agree, that if he hadnt used a gun the emotional outbursts of critics would have been dissapated.

 

[Pythagorean]

You're knitpicking definitions to defend your side of the argument. It demonstrates desperation.

Pre meditated has nothing to do with inhibition; it's still loss of control if an addict takes that hit of crack, even if he's meditated on that hit for weeks.

If he would have yelled at her or just embarassed get publically on YouTube, it still would have been the same reaction from those of us who actually study effective vs ineffective parenting styles. You demonstrate control, you have discussions, you don't give up and shoot things just because it's "not working". It not going to show that it's worked until they've been around a good role model for 20 years. It takes a lot of patience.

 

[xxChrisxx]

And guns don't kill people, people kill people.

In fact I think you'll find that guns don't kill people, rappers do.
I saw it in a documentary on BBC 2

 

[Jasongreat]

You're knitpicking definitions to defend your side of the argument. It demonstrates desperation.

Pre meditated has nothing to do with inhibition; it's still loss of control if an addict takes that hit of crack, even if he's meditated on that hit for weeks.

If he would have yelled at her or just embarassed get publically on YouTube, it still would have been the same reaction from those of us who actually study effective vs ineffective parenting styles. You demonstrate control, you have discussions, you don't give up and shoot things just because it's "not working". It not going to show that it's worked until they've been around a good role model for 20 years. It takes a lot of patience.

Youre right he was smoking crack and therefore he was in the wrong? ;) which side is emotional inhibition on?

Why do we discount that she was warned, he did exactly what he said he would do? He seems like an emotional stable person. Did you read the interview, posted earlier? Like I asked, would you feel he was in the wrong for donating the computer to charity? It is still not hers anymore, how about destroying it with a bat? There is no difference, a gone computer is a gone computer, does it really matter how it was taken away? I am sorry I forgot that guns make everything wrong, I am surprised such criticism comes from alaska.

Would you say your effective parenting style precludes whatever he does? I feel each parent should be free to parent in the way they see fit, are you saying that a government should decide? Or a populous should decide on your parenting? Or it is just others' parenting that should be subject to ridicule?

 

[jim hardy]

i was fortunate.

Teenage daughter's penance was to go see Jerry McGuire movie and report back to me "What behavior makes things start to go right for him?"
I made her take boyfriend , i paid for admission but not popcorn.

She came back with correct answer "When he started making honest effort."

That started the dialog we'd been needing to have.
Long story short - turning point, happy ending.

"Show me the money " ? Hogwash. Earn the money.

 

[Pythagorean]

Youre right he was smoking crack and therefore he was in the wrong? ;) which side is emotional inhibition on?

Why do we discount that she was warned, he did exactly what he said he would do? He seems like an emotional stable person. Did you read the interview, posted earlier? Like I asked, would you feel he was in the wrong for donating the computer to charity? It is still not hers anymore, how about destroying it with a bat? There is no difference, a gone computer is a gone computer, does it really matter how it was taken away? I am sorry I forgot that guns make everything wrong, I am surprised such criticism comes from alaska.

Would you say your effective parenting style precludes whatever he does? I feel each parent should be free to parent in the way they see fit, are you saying that a government should decide? Or a populous should decide on your parenting? Or it is just others' parenting that should be subject to ridicule?

The props don't matter. Gun, computer, whatever; youre still using distraction tactics.

It's about conflict resolution. He is not handling the conflict well (or, more importantly, teaching his daughter how to handle conflict well). It's more about tone and action than the medium through which the actions are carried.

I don't mind guns at all; I own a few. I've only ever used them to kill game. Never out of anger, and certainly not to intimidate friends or family.

 

[Jasongreat]

The props don't matter. Gun, computer, whatever; youre still using distraction tactics.

It's about conflict resolution. He is not handling the conflict well (or, more importantly, teaching his daughter how to handle conflict well). It's more about tone and action than the medium through which the actions are carried.

I don't mind guns at all; I own a few. I've only ever used them to kill game. Never out of anger, and certainly not to intimidate friends or family.

I didnt think you did, I have enjoyed your reasonable posts for a while now, excepting ones to this post. :) I am wondering though, how he didnt act appropiately. He warned his daughter of the actions he was thinking of, he did exactly what he said he would do, how is this not a life lesson for his daughter? From what I have read she seemed to have an entitlement attitude, he showed her that, I provided you with the comoputer, I have warned about the use of that computer, if you choose to use said computer for what he considered wrong, he would destroy said computer. She chose to test him, her computer is now gone, how was he in the wrong? He did exactly what he said he would do.

I do disagree in the public manner it was done, but as I have said earlier,she dissed him in public, he dissed her in public, isn't that an eye for an eye? I don't see what he could have done differently, he warned her, he had to follow through, or what would that say?

 

[xxChrisxx]

The props don't matter. Gun, computer, whatever; youre still using distraction tactics.

It's about conflict resolution. He is not handling the conflict well (or, more importantly, teaching his daughter how to handle conflict well). It's more about tone and action than the medium through which the actions are carried.

What a load of namby pamby tosh. Shock value works brilliantly, especially if it's done out of the blue.
The laptop being shot to bits is rather more theatric and shocking than it being locked in a cupboard.

I'm all for it, I'd have used a lump hammer.

 

[micromass]

What a load of namby pamby tosh. Shock value works brilliantly, especially if it's done out of the blue.
The laptop being shot to bits is rather more theatric and shocking than it being locked in a cupboard.

I'm all for it, I'd have used a lump hammer.

If you want shock value, why not beat the girl senseless?? Obviously that's not a good idea, so you probably agree that parents should respect boundaries. Making a point with a lethal weapon crosses such a boundary.

 

[xxChrisxx]

If you want shock value, why not beat the girl senseless??

Shows a lack of imagination, and that's not shocking.

Throwing it into the sea would be equally brilliant, but has the downside of requiring the sea to be within a reasonable distance.

 

[Pythagorean]

What a load of namby pamby tosh. Shock value works brilliantly, especially if it's done out of the blue.
The laptop being shot to bits is rather more theatric and shocking than it being locked in a cupboard.

I'm all for it, I'd have used a lump hammer.

So does shaking children violently. That it works in the short-term is not what good parenting is about. That kind of short tem satisfaction is more about solving your own annoyances. Don't exactly have your children's long term development in mind in that case, do you?

And "namby pamby tosh" is called ad homonym: a good sign somebody hasn't really thought about the mechanics of their "argument".

 

[xxChrisxx]

So does shaking children violently. That it works in the short-term is not what good parenting is about. That kind of short tem satisfaction is more about solving your own annoyances. Don't exactly have your children's long term development in mind, do you.

And "namby pamby tosh" is called ad homonym: a good sign somebody hasn't really thought about the mechanics of their "argument".

All this political correctness gone mad that we can't even lock them in a chest for 8 hours anymore without anyone calling the social.

Madness.

 

[Pythagorean]

If by lock in chest, you mean forever in your heart, then that's ok :)

 

[Hurkyl]

The props don't matter. Gun, computer, whatever; youre still using distraction tactics.
...
I don't mind guns at all; I own a few. I've only ever used them to kill game. Never out of anger, and certainly not to intimidate friends or family.

First you said the props don't matter, then you condemn his choice of props?

 

[Pythagorean]

They're two separate issues. One is about parenting, the other is about gun safety. Jason referred to my statehood when he was pulling several irrelevant different things together. Your comment wouldn't have been very productive either way, though...

 

[Pythagorean]

I understand people at nit picking becaus they want to justify their feelings about the matter, but this is really simple with bad behavior. You can teach, you can threaten, you can punish, and you can demonstrate by example. Only one of the above is effective in orders of magnitude above the others: example. So the strongest lesson he passed along was "shoot things when you're angry or hurt".

If you've "tried discussion" already, your job isn't through; you still have all that refraining from resorting to demonstrated aggression to get through. In this case, the father wasn't able to get through that part.

 

[Hurkyl]

They're two separate issues. One is about parenting, the other is about gun safety. Jason referred to my statehood when he was pulling several irrelevant different things together. Your comment wouldn't have been very productive either way, though...

They could be separate issues, but judging from your posts, I honestly don't believe you are actually keeping them separate in your mind.

In any case, you're certainly not keeping them separate in your posts, though. I do think my comment has already been rather productive; the contradiction has been highlighted, it prompted elaboration, and I even mildly expect you'll pay more attention to separating the issues in the future.

 

[Pythagorean]

It doesn't matter; the parenting stand alone without the props. The props are additional no-nos. If I were to charge somebody for assault with a gun, sure I'd get the extra charges with the gun, but the assault is really the issue.

On the other hand, a video about him cleaning his gun would have been fine.

I don't see why you're trying to conflate this.

 

[ThomasT]

after she calls him every dirty name in the book and thinks he won't find out, of course.

Article here: www.zdnet.com/blog/igeneration/father-puts-45-through-teen-daughters-laptop-over-facebook-post/15147



Now opinions will vary on this, but I for one have to agree with the dad. If you read the article, you see that he had warned her earlier about how if she abuses her privilege again, he'll put a bullet in the laptop, and she did just that. This is definitely novel parenting, but I think it's good parenting.

Note: Link contains 8 minute video from the father in question.

I think it's good parenting also. Apparently they have a very strong willed, and spoiled, daughter. Teenagers are, by nature I think, rebellious. I know I was. No particular reason for it. And when that rebelliousness manifests in unnacceptable ways, then it should be punished. So, imho, good for Dad and Mom, and shame on the kid, who'll hopefully learn from her mistake and understand her Dad's response.

And for those who say that violence isn't a solution to problems. Imo, violence, or the threat of violence, is the solution to most problems of this sort.

 

[Dembadon]

Personally, I think the video is fake. The "father" had a dead laptop and wanted to post a video on youtube that would obtain a lot of views, so he put a few bullets through something he was just planning on throwing away anyways.

 

[Dembadon]

I don't think so.
The way he loses command of his language every now and then, trembling while regaining control, looks very genuine.

People do that when they're trying to act, too.

 

[Hurkyl]

I don't see why you're trying to conflate this.

I'm not. You had conflated them; I'm just making you face it. You have repeatedly compare <your idea of good parenting> against <threatening people with guns>.

You even rejected Jasongreat's attempt to disentangle the notions and just talk about the notion of threatening to permanently take away her computer if she used it inappropriately, and following through.