Freeeeeeedom, 300 years on well maybe

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300 years after the Scot's hand was forced into signing the act of Union with the English, there is some REAL debate on whether the Union is mutually beneficial. Whether being *British* is still something that Scots are proud of, and want to keep. Whether Being independent from Westminster's rule will cause havoc throughout the British isles or will make Scotland a more strong and economically better place.

Today is the 300th anniversary of the signing of the Act of Union between England and Scotland, and if the latest political opinion polls are to be believed it may be one of the last. In little over four months the Scottish parliamentary elections could see the Scottish National Party (SNP) win power, or at least enough votes to hold the balance of influence and push a referendum on independence. And according to recent polls, around 52 per cent of Scots would back moves to dissolve the Union of 1707, which means that after three centuries of shared blood, toil and tears, the marriage of convenience that turned a small island into a world power is shaping up for divorce.
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/features/article2158022.ece [Broken]

Personally I think (without sitting on the fence to much) there are many good points, and equally as many bad points to Dissolving the Union. Scotland could prosper by going its own way, but it would be an uphill battle to begin with. Ireland is a good case study for this. Their Economy is now BOOMING. They have a wealth of Jobs, due to some clever Political decisions, and whats more is that Scotland also has far more natural resources.

Tony Blair doesnt hold the same opinion as the SNP however:
Splitting up England and Scotland would be "an incredibly regressive and reactionary step" and would cause damage to the Scottish economy, Tony Blair said today at his monthly press conference.

Speaking in Downing Street, the Prime Minister urged people to celebrate the 300th anniversary of the Act of Union - and warned that it would be "crazy" for Scotland to choose to split with England.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-2549709,00.html

This is more of a political crocodile than football, as it could, and IMHO will, rear its head and bite some unsuspecting Politician Leg, or perhaps head off if you dismiss this issue to lightly
 
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  • #2
Kurdt
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I am not at all fond of this idea. The union says certain things about the people of the two countries, that they have set aside certain social, political and cultural differences to work together. The world should as a whole be becoming more united not less. I realise that Scotland felt it was getting a bit of a bad deal in recent decades with respect to policy implementation, but one has to realise that britain has been recovering from the heavy costs of the second world war which primarily effected the south east of England. I live in the north east of England and can sympathise with this to an extent, but the whole point of devolution of government was for the Scottish people to make better decisions for themselves while still maintaining the strength of the two nations as one.

The one thing I hate at the minute is how the different countries of the United kingdom have all kind of turned on each other. It makes me very uneasy that after so long it has come to this. I have no words to articulate my feelings at the minute so i'll leave it there.
 
  • #3
Gokul43201
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What would happen to the SIGINT stations in Hawklaw and Brora and the RAF bases at Edzell, Prestwick, etc? The Brits have much more than economic reasons for worry.
 
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  • #4
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I favor small goverment
the only way to get smaller goverment
is smaller countrys
the euro union has replaced the super state
with a more limited regional goverment
so I see little down side to this idea
 
  • #5
Garth
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What would happen to the SIGINT stations in Hawklaw and Brora and the RAF bases at Edzell, Prestwick, etc? The Brits have much more than economic reasons for worry.
Don't you mean the English will have more than economic reasons for worry?

Scots are "Brits", alongside the Welsh, N.Irish and English.

The RAF bases will move south of the border, they are closing down lots of bases in any case.

Garth
 
  • #6
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Don't you mean the English will have more than economic reasons for worry?

Scots are "Brits", alongside the Welsh, N.Irish and English.

The RAF bases will move south of the border, they are closing down lots of bases in any case.

Garth
Yeap, correct, also Trident would have to move.. It would be a serious endevour to detangel the two nations, but I think the English have more to loose than the scots. Scots are very split on this subject, the ecconomy north of the border is getting better now.
but one has to realise that britain has been recovering from the heavy costs of the second world war which primarily effected the south east of England.
I dont aggree this is a valid reason. The Scots coffers where used up (and blood) just as fast, (perhaps faster wrt blood). We all took a hit, the SE of England is now one of the most prosperus places in the world, while the rest of the UK was chocking on the removal of Manufacturing, especially in Scotland, NE England and Wales...
 
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  • #7
J77
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Let them split if they want.

If they did, I'd like to see the Scots embrace the euro - like Ireland has done - they got probably get a load of EU subsidies for being a poor country.

But what about our new supremo - Mr Brown - still, probably no loss there.

It'll probably end in tears...
 
  • #8
Gokul43201
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Don't you mean the English will have more than economic reasons for worry?
Yes, I misspoke.
 
  • #9
Astronuc
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Scots are "Brits", alongside the Welsh, N.Irish
:rofl: There are quite a few people in these groups who would take exception to that. :biggrin:

My ancestry spans N. Ireland, Scotland and England, and my ancestors fought on both sides of the Wars of Scottish Independence.

I think of Scotland as being distinct from England, but I hope the situation is resolved amicably. Self-determination provides a strong motivation it would seem.

Certainly one issue will be the North Sea oil.
 
  • #10
J77
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There's no issue - just mumbles and more mumbles, same as ever :smile:
 
  • #11
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If they did, I'd like to see the Scots embrace the euro - like Ireland has done - they got probably get a load of EU subsidies for being a poor country.
Owch.... the UK now gets a LOAD of cash from brussels, Billions of Euro's, because back in the day the ecconomy of the UK was flagging behind that of its continental counterparts

Part of the SNP manifesto is to join the Euro anyway.

There's no issue - just mumbles and more mumbles, same as ever
Unfortunatly I tend to aggree with that statement.. If Scotland was to Split from England then they would not have anyone to blame for their probems

There are quite a few people in these groups who would take exception to that
Actually England Scotland Wales Ireland are all part of the British Isles
 
  • #12
Garth
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:rofl: There are quite a few people in these groups who would take exception to that. :biggrin:

My ancestry spans N. Ireland, Scotland and England, and my ancestors fought on both sides of the Wars of Scottish Independence.

I think of Scotland as being distinct from England, but I hope the situation is resolved amicably. Self-determination provides a strong motivation it would seem.

Certainly one issue will be the North Sea oil.
Often confusion between British and English proliferates.

For example, in 'Mrs. Doubtfire' Robin Williams describes himself as coming from 'England' while speaking an American attempt at an obviously Scottish accent.

Would somebody from the Southern States call him/herself a Yankee, because in the rest of the world 'Yank' means somebody from the U.S.A.?

Union was first achieved by England taking on a Scottish King, not the other way round, King James VI of Scotland from 1567 became James I of England in 1603. The Scottish Parliament was finally dissolved in 1707 and re-established in 1999.

If Scotland gains its independence then I shall be able to call myself English and not British, and have an English Parliament not a British one run by Scots.....

But we are all European now. :smile:

Garth
 
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  • #13
J77
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in reply to anttech's post

Did I type: "they got probably get" ?!?

That bad use of language must come from my Dad's side...


(...Scots! :tongue: )
 
  • #14
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Union was first achieved by England taking on a Scottish King, not the other way round, King James VI of Scotland from 1567 became James I of England in 1603. The Scottish Parliament was finally dissolved in 1707 and re-established in 1999.
The Monarchy was united, ie the James was king of Scotland and England, but the seats were still not joined.

If Scotland gains its independence then I shall be able to call myself English and not British, and have an English Parliament not a British one run by Scots.....
Another good point, the UK is kinda run by Scots... And even if we split you can still call yourself British just not from the UK.. :smile:
 
  • #15
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Did I type: "they got probably get" ?!?

That bad use of language must come from my Dad's side...


(...Scots! :tongue: )
You mean much gooder use of Langauage :smile:
 
  • #16
Astronuc
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But we are all European now.
We are all part of one humanity. We probably all originated from the same puddle of mud a few billion years ago anyway. :biggrin:
 

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