How are Cepheids used to measure distances?

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter Mooky
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Measure
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the use of Cepheid variable stars for measuring astronomical distances. Participants explore the relationship between the period of Cepheids and their intrinsic brightness, as well as the methods for determining distances using these stars, including the need for parallax measurements and historical context regarding calibration challenges.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants explain that the longer the period of a Cepheid, the higher its intrinsic brightness, which allows for distance calculations when comparing intrinsic and apparent brightness.
  • Others argue that a Cepheid must be close enough for parallax measurement to establish a standard for distance measurement, highlighting a historical limitation in the astronomical distance scale.
  • One participant notes that uncertainties in calibrating the Cepheid relationship have led to re-assessments of the universe's size over time.
  • Another participant mentions that advancements, such as measurements by the Hubble Space Telescope, have resolved some of the previous issues regarding parallax measurements of Cepheids.
  • There is a mention of the increasing number of Cepheids available for study, particularly with future missions like Gaia expected to provide more data.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the clarity of the explanation regarding Cepheid distance measurement, with some emphasizing the need for parallax standards and others focusing on the relationship between period and brightness. The discussion reflects unresolved issues regarding historical calibration methods and current advancements.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the dependence on parallax measurements for establishing distance standards and the historical context of calibration uncertainties, which may affect the interpretation of Cepheid distances.

Mooky
Messages
20
Reaction score
0
Hello,

I've read about this in four different textbooks and in several websites, but I still don't get it: how are Cepheids used to measure distances? I understand that Cepheids are stars whose brightness varies periodically; that the longer their period, the brighter they are; and that different Cepheids have different brightness and periods.

But, how is that used to measure distances?

Thanks,
M
 
Astronomy news on Phys.org
Note that the longer the period, the higher their intrinsic brightness. So you measure the period, and then from the relation between period and intrinsic brightness, you now know their intrinsic brightness - that is how bright they really are. Then you measure their apparent brightness - that is how bright they appear. Because of the inverse square law, if we have two objects of the same intrinsic brightness at two different distances, the one further away will appear fainter, just like with two identical street lights - the one further away will appear fainter. So if I know the intrinsic brightness and the apparent brightness, I can calculate the distance. Mathematically, the relation between the two is given here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnitude_(astronomy)
 
That explains nothing, mate. They would need a Cepheid close enough for parallax measurement to use as a standard first.
 
Cryptonic said:
That explains nothing, mate. They would need a Cepheid close enough for parallax measurement to use as a standard first.

In fact, for many years, this point was the weakest link in the astronomical distance scale, since no Cepheids were close enough to use parallax to measure their distance. So historically other methods were used to get the distance to the nearest Cepheids and calibrate the relationship. Uncertainties in the calibration of the Cepheid relationship led to several re-assessments of the size of the universe. Try reading this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_distance_ladder

However, this is no longer an issue, since the Hubble space telescope was now able to measure the parallax of Delta Cephei, the prototypical cepheid. See this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_Cephei
 
Cryptonic said:
That explains nothing, mate. They would need a Cepheid close enough for parallax measurement to use as a standard first.

And there now 273 such objects. There should be many more when Gaia launches.
 
Thank you, phyzguy. I wish textbooks were as clear and concise as you are.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
4K
  • · Replies 23 ·
Replies
23
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K