How do you eliminate one term of several in a denominator?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around algebraic manipulation of a fraction involving multiple terms in the denominator. Participants explore methods to isolate a specific term, ##r_{\text{mo}}##, from a given equation. The focus is primarily on algebraic rules and techniques rather than the physical significance of the terms involved.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents an equation and asks if multiplying both sides by ##r_{\text{mo}}^2## leads to a specific result.
  • Another participant suggests taking reciprocals as a potential method.
  • There is a discussion about the validity of the initial method proposed, with some arguing that the algebraic rules allow for exchanging numerators and denominators.
  • One participant describes their process of factoring the denominator and manipulating the equation step by step to isolate ##r_{\text{mo}}##.
  • Another participant expresses uncertainty about their solution and asks for feedback on where they may have gone wrong.
  • Several participants provide their own solutions and express agreement on the correctness of the final result, while also noting differences in their approaches.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best method for isolating ##r_{\text{mo}}##, with multiple approaches and some disagreement on the correctness of specific steps. However, there is acknowledgment of the validity of different solutions presented.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express confusion over the algebraic manipulations and the correctness of their methods, indicating that there may be unresolved steps or assumptions in their reasoning.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in algebraic manipulation, particularly in the context of physics or engineering problems, may find the discussion relevant.

5P@N
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So I have this fraction:$$\frac {mass_{\text{mo}}}{r_{\text{mo}}^2} = \frac {mass_{\text{ea}}}{(\text{KLCOM})^2 -2((\text{KLCOM}) (r_{\text{mo}})) + (r_{\text{mo}})^2}$$

Don't worry about what these various terms represent - my question has only to do with an algebraic rule I've forgotten. I am trying to isolate one of the ##r_{\text{mo}}## terms. So my question is basically this: if I was to multiply both sides by ##r_{\text{mo}}^2##, would it result in the following equation?
$$mass_{\text{mo}} = \frac {mass_{\text{ea}}}{(\text{KLCOM})^2 -2((\text{KLCOM}) (r_{\text{mo}}))}$$
 
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Have you tried simply taking reciprocals?
 
No. What sort of reciprocal?

Is my method correct, or do I need to use another method, because I've gotten the algebraic rule wrong?
 
5P@N said:
Is my method correct, or do I need to use another method, because I've gotten the algebraic rule wrong?
No.
The rules that apply here are ##\frac{a}{b} = \frac{c}{d} ⇔ a \cdot d = b \cdot c ⇔ \frac{b}{a} = \frac{d}{c} ## if none of the numbers is zero.
Since your masses are probably not zero you can just exchange numerator and denominator on both sides.
 
5P@N said:
So I have this fraction:$$\frac {mass_{\text{mo}}}{r_{\text{mo}}^2} = \frac {mass_{\text{ea}}}{(\text{KLCOM})^2 -2((\text{KLCOM}) (r_{\text{mo}})) + (r_{\text{mo}})^2}$$

Don't worry about what these various terms represent - my question has only to do with an algebraic rule I've forgotten. I am trying to isolate one of the ##r_{\text{mo}}## terms. So my question is basically this: if I was to multiply both sides by ##r_{\text{mo}}^2##, would it result in the following equation?
$$mass_{\text{mo}} = \frac {mass_{\text{ea}}}{(\text{KLCOM})^2 -2((\text{KLCOM}) (r_{\text{mo}}))}$$

No, not even close.

You can solve for rmo by recognizing that the denominator on the RHS can be factored. By multiplying both sides by rmo and dividing both sides by massea, you can eventually come up with an expression for rmo in terms of KLCOM and the ratio of the masses.
 
Allright: I factored out the denominator on the RHS, then multiplied both sides by rmo. Then I inverted both fractions, and got the square root of both. Then on the RHS I expressed the fraction as two fractions, simplified, subtracted 1 from both sides, divided both sides by KLCOM, then inverted both fractions once again. Here is my answer:
$$\frac{KLCOM}{\sqrt{\frac{\text{mass}_{\text{ea}}}{\text{mass}_{\text{mo}}}} +1} = r_{\text{mo}}$$

Kosher?
 
5P@N said:
Allright: I factored out the denominator on the RHS, then multiplied both sides by rmo. Then I inverted both fractions, and got the square root of both. Then on the RHS I expressed the fraction as two fractions, simplified, subtracted 1 from both sides, divided both sides by KLCOM, then inverted both fractions once again. Here is my answer:
$$\frac{KLCOM}{\sqrt{\frac{\text{mass}_{\text{ea}}}{\text{mass}_{\text{mo}}}} +1} = r_{\text{mo}}$$

Kosher?
No, you're close, but you seem to have made some mistakes before you got here.

It would be better if you posted all your work leading up to this.
 
:H
Very well...

I begin with having the denominator on the RHS factored, to yield:$$\frac{\text{mass}_{\text{mo}}}{r_{\text{mo}}^2} = \frac{\text{mass}_{\text{ea}}}{(\text{KLCOM} - r_{\text{mo}})^2}$$

Then I multiply both sides by ##r_{\text{mo}}^2##, and divide both sides by ##\text{mass}_{\text{ea}}## to yield:$$\frac{\text{mass}_{\text{mo}}}{\text{mass}_{\text{ea}}} = \frac{r_{\text{mo}}^2}{(\text{KLCOM} - r_{\text{mo}})^2}$$

Next I switch the numerators and denominators on both sides: $$\frac{\text{mass}_{\text{ea}}}{\text{mass}_{\text{mo}}} = \frac{(\text{KLCOM} - r_{\text{mo}})^2}{r_{\text{mo}}^2}$$

Then I get the square root of both sides:$$\sqrt{\frac{\text{mass}_{\text{ea}}}{\text{mass}_{\text{mo}}}} = \frac{\text{KLCOM} - r_{\text{mo}}}{r_{\text{mo}}}$$

On the RHS, with one common denominator, I then render it into two terms:$$\sqrt{\frac{\text{mass}_{\text{ea}}}{\text{mass}_{\text{mo}}}} = \frac{\text{KLCOM}}{r_{\text{mo}}} -\frac{r_{\text{mo}}}{r_{\text{mo}}}$$

The second term on the RHS simplifies to -1, which I add to both sides viz:$$\sqrt{\frac{\text{mass}_{\text{ea}}}{\text{mass}_{\text{mo}}}} +1 = \frac{\text{KLCOM}}{r_{\text{mo}}}$$

Then I divide both sides by KLCOM:$$\frac{\sqrt{\frac{\text{mass}_{\text{ea}}}{\text{mass}_{\text{mo}}}} +1}{\text{KLCOM}} = \frac{1}{ r_{\text{mo}}}$$

Finally, I invert the numerators and denominators one last time to yield (triumphant trumpet flourish): THE WRONG ANSWER! YAY!:$$\frac{\text{KLCOM}}{\sqrt{\frac{\text{mass}_{\text{ea}}}{\text{mass}_{\text{mo}}}} +1}{} = r_{\text{mo}}$$

All of this more than begs the question: where did I go wrong?
 
Should be correct. My bad eyes just don't see the mass indices very well. I've got "ea / mo".
 
  • #10
In making my solution of rmo, I didn't make as many inversions as you did.

My solution came out:

$$r_{mo}=\frac{KCMOL ⋅ \sqrt{\frac{mass_{mo}}{mass_{ea}}}}{1+\sqrt{\frac{mass_{mo}}{mass_{ea}}}}$$

If you do some more manipulation, I agree with your result, which is more elegant. :smile:
 
  • #11
So I was right after all?
 
  • #12
5P@N said:
So I was right after all?
Yes.
 

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