How Does Shankar Transition from Sums to Integrals in Feynman Path Integrals?

In summary, the conversation focuses on the use of integrals in place of sums in Shankar's treatment of Feynman Integrals. The speaker has a lingering doubt about the inclusion of an infinitesimal factor in the sums and seeks clarification on the use of path integrals. The other person suggests thinking of path integrals as a normal function for practical purposes and mentions the challenging task of rigorously defining it. The conversation ends with a reference to White Noise Theory and a comparison to the use of infinitesimal factors in calculus.
  • #1
Opus_723
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I am going through Shankar's treatment of Feynman Integrals right now, and I have one lingering doubt that I can't quite seem to work out.

I was pretty happy with the idea of discretizing time, then doing independent sums over xi at each time. But Shankar simply says that we can consider the sums over xi to be integrals. I don't quite follow this. Normally when you pass from a sum to an integral there has to be some infinitesimal factor in each term of your sum. Shankar just says that the sum over the phase factors becomes an integral in xi over the phase factors, but I don't see where the "dx" comes from in order to let us do that. I have a suspicion that something deeper is going on, but I can't quite grasp it.

I've actually noticed this sort of thing in a couple of other places. For example, the completeness relation for operators with discrete spectra seems to pick up an infinitesimal "d_" that doesn't seem to have a counterpart in the completeness relation for operators with discrete spectra. This may be completely unrelated to the path integrals. But I get the feeling that I'm missing something either very obvious or very subtle, because this sort of thing keeps coming up in QM. Could anyone help me clear this up?
 
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  • #2
Opus_723 said:
I've actually noticed this sort of thing in a couple of other places. For example, the completeness relation for operators with discrete spectra seems to pick up an infinitesimal "d_" that doesn't seem to have a counterpart in the completeness relation for operators with discrete spectra. This may be completely unrelated to the path integrals. But I get the feeling that I'm missing something either very obvious or very subtle, because this sort of thing keeps coming up in QM. Could anyone help me clear this up?

In short, this is because the orthonormality of basis vectors is like ##\left<\psi_i \right.\left|\psi_j \right.\left.\right> = \delta_{ij}## in the discrete case and ##\left<x \right.\left|x' \right.\left.\right> = \delta (x-x' )## in the continuum case (in the first case there's a Kronecker delta and in the second there's a Dirac delta).
 
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  • #3
Actually defining path integrals properly is rather difficult and touches on some rather interesting, but advanced areas of applied math such as White Noise Theory:
http://www.kurims.kyoto-u.ac.jp/~kyodo/kokyuroku/contents/pdf/1797-03.pdf

At the level below that ie at the level of the typical undergrad treat it like you would the Dirac Delta function - a normal function that for all practical purposes has that property - simply think of the path integral like a post I did about it ages ago:

You start out with <x'|x> then you insert a ton of ∫|xi><xi|dxi = 1 in the middle to get ∫...∫<x|x1><x1|...|xn><xn|x> dx1...dxn. Now <xi|xi+1> = ci e^iSi so rearranging you get ∫...∫c1...cn e^ i∑Si.

To get the path integral you are supposed to take the limit - but rigorously defining such is rather difficult. So just think of it as something where the difference between the xi is very small - but not actually zero. Sort of like you do in the early stages on calculus with how you view the integral as a sum with the Δx really small.

Thanks
Bill
 

Related to How Does Shankar Transition from Sums to Integrals in Feynman Path Integrals?

1. What is a Feynman integral?

A Feynman integral is a mathematical tool used in quantum field theory to calculate the probability amplitude of a quantum system. It was developed by physicist Richard Feynman and is also known as a path integral.

2. How is a Feynman integral different from other integrals?

A Feynman integral is a functional integral, meaning it integrates over all possible paths of a particle rather than a single variable. It also involves complex numbers and is used to calculate probability amplitudes rather than a numerical value.

3. What is the significance of Feynman integrals in physics?

Feynman integrals are an essential tool in quantum field theory, which is used to describe the behavior of subatomic particles. They allow for the calculation of complex interactions and play a crucial role in understanding the behavior of particles at the quantum level.

4. How are Feynman integrals calculated?

Feynman integrals involve a complex mathematical process, but in general, they can be calculated by breaking down the integral into smaller parts and using known mathematical techniques to solve them. It also involves the use of diagrams and diagrams called Feynman diagrams.

5. What are some applications of Feynman integrals?

Feynman integrals have numerous applications in physics, including calculations in quantum electrodynamics, quantum chromodynamics, and the standard model of particle physics. They are also used in other fields such as statistical mechanics, condensed matter physics, and cosmology.

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