How to find minimum turning points

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the minimum turning points of the function f(x) = Asin²(x) + Bcos²(x) + Csin(2x). Participants explore the derivatives of the function to identify conditions for minima and express challenges in determining the exact locations of these minima, particularly due to the periodic nature of the trigonometric functions involved.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant calculates the first derivative f'(x) and sets it to zero to find turning points, leading to the equation tan(2x) = 2C / (B - A).
  • Another participant expresses uncertainty about proceeding with the second derivative f''(x) and the implications of the signs of sin and cos in determining minima.
  • A different approach is suggested, rewriting f(x) in terms of a sine function, leading to the conclusion that minima occur when sin(2x + α) = -1.
  • One participant calculates the angle α and derives a formula for x, but acknowledges the periodic nature of the tangent function introduces ambiguity in the solutions.
  • Another participant introduces constraints on A, B, and C, suggesting that these may lead to a unique solution in simulations, though they remain uncertain about the reasoning behind this uniqueness.
  • A later reply clarifies that the function f(x) has a period of π, indicating that there are two minima within the interval 0 ≤ x < 2π.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various approaches and insights, but there is no consensus on the exact locations of the minima or the implications of the derived conditions. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the uniqueness of solutions and the impact of constraints.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the periodic nature of the function and the implications of the trigonometric identities used, which may affect the determination of minima. There are also unresolved aspects regarding the constraints on A, B, and C and their influence on the solutions.

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I have a function:

f(x) = Asin2(x) + Bcos2(x) + Csin(2x)

and I want to find the minimum turning point(s). To start with, I calculated:

f'(x) = (A - B)sin(2x) + 2Ccos(2x)

Therefore, turning points occur when f'(x)=0, or:

tan(2x) = 2C / (B - A)

To find the minima, I then want to look at the 2nd derivative:

f''(x) = 2(A - B)cos(2x) - 4Csin(2x)

So, as far as I understand, minima will occur when both f'(x)=0 and f''(x)>0. So the second inequality can be expressed as:

2(A - B)cos(2x) > 4Csin(2x)

Now I'm having trouble knowing how to proceed. Since sin and cos can be positive or negative depending on x, I can't see a neat way of really understanding where the minima will be. Could anyone help?
 
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weetabixharry said:
I have a function:

f(x) = Asin2(x) + Bcos2(x) + Csin(2x)

and I want to find the minimum turning point(s). To start with, I calculated:

f'(x) = (A - B)sin(2x) + 2Ccos(2x)

Therefore, turning points occur when f'(x)=0, or:

tan(2x) = 2C / (B - A)

To find the minima, I then want to look at the 2nd derivative:

f''(x) = 2(A - B)cos(2x) - 4Csin(2x)

So, as far as I understand, minima will occur when both f'(x)=0 and f''(x)>0. So the second inequality can be expressed as:

2(A - B)cos(2x) > 4Csin(2x)

Now I'm having trouble knowing how to proceed. Since sin and cos can be positive or negative depending on x, I can't see a neat way of really understanding where the minima will be. Could anyone help?

Best to put <br /> f(x) = \frac12(A + B) + \frac12(B - A)\cos(2x) + C \sin(2x)<br /> = \frac12(A + B) + R\sin(2x + \alpha)<br />
using <br /> R\sin(2x + \alpha) = R\sin(\alpha)\cos(2x) + R\cos(\alpha)\sin(2x).<br />
The minima then occur when \sin(2x + \alpha) = -1.
 
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Okay that's really clever... it's taken me a while to figure out how that works.

So, if I have 0 \leq x &lt; 2\pi, I think taking the arcsin would give:\alpha+2x=\frac{3\pi}{2}Then, given how we've defined \alpha, I feel like we can say:\tan\alpha = \frac{(B-A)}{2C}Putting those things together, I get:x=\frac{3\pi}{4}-\frac{1}{2}\tan^{-1}\left\{\frac{(B-A)}{2C}\right\}Hmm... but given that tan(x) repeats itself twice on the interval I'm interested in (0 \leq x &lt; 2\pi) ... I feel like I've just reintroduced ambiguity.

I'm a bit out of my depth, so I've crunched some numbers with some computer simulations... and this x seems to sometimes give the minimum, sometimes the maximum. I feel like I need to somehow constrain (B - A)/2C ... but at the moment I'm somewhere on a slippery slope to proving 1 = 0...
 
I've looked more closely at my problem and have determined three further constraints:A\geq0\\B\geq0\\C\sin(2x)\geq0Imposing these constraints seems to provide a unique solution in my computer simulations... but I'm not really certain why. Can anyone offer any insight?
 
weetabixharry said:
Okay that's really clever... it's taken me a while to figure out how that works.

So, if I have 0 \leq x &lt; 2\pi, I think taking the arcsin would give:\alpha+2x=\frac{3\pi}{2}Then, given how we've defined \alpha, I feel like we can say:\tan\alpha = \frac{(B-A)}{2C}Putting those things together, I get:x=\frac{3\pi}{4}-\frac{1}{2}\tan^{-1}\left\{\frac{(B-A)}{2C}\right\}Hmm... but given that tan(x) repeats itself twice on the interval I'm interested in (0 \leq x &lt; 2\pi) ... I feel like I've just reintroduced ambiguity.

That is to be expected, because f(x) has a period of \pi, not 2\pi. Thus there are two minima in 0 \leq x \leq 2\pi.
 

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