I don't feel fine -- I need some moral advice

[Utilite]

Hi i am a freshman at physics. I am probably posting this somewhere irrelevant but I need some advice.
See I am a considerably successful student and I applied for some scholarships. Here in my country education isn't paid for, there are private schools but some public schools are better than most private schools. Anyway I applied for scholarships and I have 4 scholarships. Those people didn't really check other scholarships for some reason I have all of them.
So I am being paid a lot. I am being paid 4.3k liras a month which is around 1.5-1.6k dollars but here living is extremely cheap compared to USA. I have a free dorm room, my textbooks are free. I was guaranteed to have 2.9k but those extra scholarships was a surprise.
I am not a spender and also my family sends me money. They are retired but they told me to save my money. Anyway I told my friends about my 4th scholarship which is a large one. 40 people get it and I am accepted. they got really crazy and they are like my best friends. They accused me of being cheap and being greedy but money isn't really one of my interests I only spend money at vacations and stuff. Money is like a tool i might need in the future so I am standing with my parents on this one.
I really feel bad about getting the last scholarship, my friends drove me mad I can't sleep properly last couple of days? . Should I cancel the last scholarship, or should i keep it or do something else? Any suggestions.
I am just an 18 year old who wants to do science and hangout with my buddies but now money is involved and my relationships are being destroyed.
Btw there is a fifth scholarship i am not supposed to get it I just applied because of my parents but now I have a chance of getting it.
Again I don't think if i should post this here but you guys always seem to help about these things and I just need some help.

 

[Dr. Courtney]

If it's all legal, do what you want with the money, do not feel guilty, enjoy yourself, and work hard and get a good education.

Ignore the jealous SOBs who want to get you down.

 

[Thewindyfan]

Do what you want with your extra money, but tbh what you're doing right now is good. Save it for when it's necessary instead of unnecessarily spending it. I don't see how it's greedy to earn money for your merit.

 

[Mark44]

They accused me of being cheap and being greedy but money isn't really one of my interests I only spend money at vacations and stuff. Money is like a tool i might need in the future so I am standing with my parents on this one.

I don't see this as a moral dilemma at all. I take it that you competed for the scholarships, and received them on the basis of your past hard work. There are a lot of people who spend whatever money they have, plus a lot more that they don't have (using credit cards). Being able to go to college without having to amass a large amount of debt is a good thing, despite what some of your "friends" say.

 

[Utilite]

i don't really know they want to buy expensive alcohol luxury clothes and stuff like that. One of my best friends told this to me. "you are a bastard and from now on you are going to pay for everything when we meet." isn't this very disrespectful, he is an amazing guy normally. One friend of mine accused me of being cheap simply because i don't have a beverage with my meals. As you can see i am deeply stressed about this thing.

 

[billy_joule]

i don't really know they want to buy expensive alcohol luxury clothes and stuff like that. One of my best friends told this to me. "you are a bastard and from now on you are going to pay for everything when we meet." isn't this very disrespectful, he is an amazing guy normally. One friend of mine accused me of being cheap simply because i don't have a beverage with my meals. As you can see i am deeply stressed about this thing.

The only problem you have is that you need new friends. Real friends would be happy to see you succeed.

 

[ZapperZ]

Actually the only problem that you have is your need to blab about all your scholarships to your friends. Why do you even tell them anything in the first place?

You are learning, albeit painfully, one of the things that an ADULT has to learn, which is when to be discrete and keep private things private.

Zz.

 

[Dishsoap]

Like some have mentioned, if your friends are anything but happy for you (or outwardly showing anything other than this), then you need new friends. Don't you dare cancel your last scholarship; it sounds like you've worked hard and earned it. Like you, I am also over-scholarshipped, and get several thousand each school year outside of tuition/housing/books. My advice is to use it to pay off any already-existing loans, and beyond that to either wisely invest it or save it.

 

[Utilite]

Actually the only problem that you have is your need to blab about all your scholarships to your friends. Why do you even tell them anything in the first place?

You are learning, albeit painfully, one of the things that an ADULT has to learn, which is when to be discrete and keep private things private.

Zz.

Well I guess you might be right but this thing was quite obvious we have been talking about this for at least half a year. The real shocker for them was me getting the last one I think.

 

[Thewindyfan]

One friend of mine accused me of being cheap simply because i don't have a beverage with my meals. As you can see i am deeply stressed about this thing.

If your "friend" is stressing you out over something as trivial as that, you need to get new friends. It sounds like you're in bad company right now.

 

[micromass]

Yeah well. Scholarships are supposed to help the poor. So you taking these scholarships means some other poor guy might not be able to complete his education because of money issues. Sure, go ahead and take the money. Everybody would. But don't try and feel like a "good" person at the same time. Not that it's entirely your fault that those organizations didn't check that you already had several scholarships. But it sure isn't exactly a very moral thing to do.

 

[Silicon Waffle]

i don't really know they want to buy expensive alcohol luxury clothes and stuff like that. One of my best friends told this to me. "you are a bastard and from now on you are going to pay for everything when we meet." isn't this very disrespectful, he is an amazing guy normally. One friend of mine accused me of being cheap simply because i don't have a beverage with my meals. As you can see i am deeply stressed about this thing.

Eating a meal, drinking a coke only offers some tiny calorie intake. The whole point is socializing, if you don't want to socialize with people or the people you are interacting with always show bad attitudes towards you and your works then you can refuse to hang out with them. Your friends sound like shopaholics or types of long-legged big boob women only billionaire men prefer. It is definitely all about one's manners and attitudes to me that I will decide whom I should make friend with! And I really have a heartache feeling sorry a little for you after reading your OP.

 

[micromass]

Yeah, but we only got the perspective of the OP here. I'm not saying he's lying or anything, but perhaps things are much more complicated than we think.
Assume for example that one of his friends has a lot of money problems, but he's too ashamed to really talk about it. Then suddenly the OP starts bragging that he won 4 scholarships and has a ton of money now. Yeah, if I was his friend, I would probably be pissed off too. That does not excuse them to treat the OP like this obviously, but it does make it understandable. The moral is of course that you should never talk about money issues with other people, definitely not if the issue is that you have too much money.

 

[Utilite]

Yeah, but we only got the perspective of the OP here. I'm not saying he's lying or anything, but perhaps things are much more complicated than we think.
Assume for example that one of his friends has a lot of money problems, but he's too ashamed to really talk about it. Then suddenly the OP starts bragging that he won 4 scholarships and has a ton of money now. Yeah, if I was his friend, I would probably be pissed off too. That does not excuse them to treat the OP like this obviously, but it does make it understandable. The moral is of course that you should never talk about money issues with other people, definitely not if the issue is that you have too much money.

Yes I think one of my friends are having some problems with money but she is the most respectful of four people. This has been long going I am avoiding unnecessary expenses for years. I don't really buy expensive stuff unless I actually want to. I prefer nice little restaurants, I have regular black coffee instead of those filled with sugar and fats. Just because I am waiting for Christmas sale to buy some video games doesn't imply i am cheap does it?
I think what pissed of those people is me having those scholarships and not spending the money, they would be totally cool if I spent like crazy. Also they are questioning me saving my money. For them money is just something to have fun with, for me it is a tool i might use for a better future. I don't know what should I do with that money right now but there is a huge possibility of me needing it.
Btw my parents were doctor's so whenever I asked for something I somehow got it unless it is really absurd. I think they didn't really have that kind of chance so I think they just can't understand me

 

[Cruz Martinez]

So, why are you keeping the scholarship if you do not need it. There is GOOD reason why organizations which grant scholarships do backround checks looking for others you maay have, the funds are limited and the purpose is to help as many people who need it as possible.

Also you complain your friends didnt have the kind of chance you had of getting everything you wanted, and so they can't understand you. Well, perhaps it is you who didnt ever have to worry about money and don't understand them?

 

[micromass]

Btw my parents were doctor's so whenever I asked for something I somehow got it unless it is really absurd. I think they didn't really have that kind of chance so I think they just can't understand me

Yeah, you were a spoiled child (compared to them), they weren't. You said it yourself that they have struggled with money their entire life. Then you walk in as the child of a doctor and you start bragging about how you played the system and obtained 4 scholarships and maybe even a fifth one. Do you really find it surprising that they don't like this from you?

Don't ever talk about money with other people. And perhaps start thinking about giving back the scholarship money. You're not supposed to have it and you're taking away the opportunity of another student to get an education.

 

[Utilite]

Yeah, you were a spoiled child (compared to them), they weren't. You said it yourself that they have struggled with money their entire life. Then you walk in as the child of a doctor and you start bragging about how you played the system and obtained 4 scholarships and maybe even a fifth one. Do you really find it surprising that they don't like this from you?

Don't ever talk about money with other people. And perhaps start thinking about giving back the scholarship money. You're not supposed to have it and you're taking away the opportunity of another student to get an education.

Yes you are right about one thing, I can't have these scholarships and be a nice person at the same time but does keeping these scholarships make me a bad person. See money is independence and right now I am not really dependent to anyone so that's a nice thing. Not all of those four people have struggled with money. Two of them are also doctor children, only one of them seems to be in need of money.
And also these scholarships aren't need based. Three of those are gvt scholarships, I got two of those because of my success at exams. And one is because of studying physics very little people study sciences in here unless they have to (all of those four people are at medschool). One of them is a foundation I am having 'High Achievement Scholarship' that foundation also grants scholarships to people in need.
Anyway thanks for your comments really. I am still not fine with this thing but the solution is not to talk about money and all that caused this problem. If keeping these aren't-you know-evil I intend to keep the money. Btw retirement salaries of my parents are quite low I am almost making as much as they do.

 

[micromass]

Yes you are right about one thing, I can't have these scholarships and be a nice person at the same time but does keeping these scholarships make me a bad person.

I don't know. On the one hand, you didn't do anything illegal or anything. You applied for the scholarships and won them fairly. It's not your fault that they're giving away money in this system. You are simply using the system in the way it is designed. The question is, is it the right thing to do, to use the system like this? I'd say no and I wouldn't feel good about myself. But somebody else might very well say yes. We would both have good arguments. In the end, you need to be able to live with yourself. That's the important thing.

 

[Fightfish]

Those people didn't really check other scholarships for some reason I have all of them.

It can be quite hard for one scholarship awarding body to be aware of other scholarships that you may have been awarded - because well, there is no reason why they keep each other updated of their own lists at all. That being said, it might be prudent of you to check the relevant terms and conditions of your scholarships as to whether it is indeed legal to hold several simultaneously. Many scholarship awarding bodies, as I know, usually require that you keep them informed about any other awards/scholarships/etc. that you are holding on to / are awarded.

 

[Utilite]

It can be quite hard for one scholarship awarding body to be aware of other scholarships that you may have been awarded - because well, there is no reason why they keep each other updated of their own lists at all. That being said, it might be prudent of you to check the relevant terms and conditions of your scholarships as to whether it is indeed legal to hold several simultaneously. Many scholarship awarding bodies, as I know, usually require that you keep them informed about any other awards/scholarships/etc. that you are holding on to / are awarded.

Yes I did check everything and I actually talked to the foundation that granted me, they know that I am getting a big scholarship from the gvt I don't think they care

 

[Fightfish]

Well, if none of the scholarships are needs-based, then honestly there is no need to be so hard on yourself, because there is no guarantee that they would go to a needy student anyway. As many have pointed out, what is important is that you are able to live with yourself. If you still feel bad, why not consider donating a portion of your stipend to a needy student fund or to charities?

 

[Utilite]

Well, if none of the scholarships are needs-based, then honestly there is no need to be so hard on yourself, because there is no guarantee that they would go to a needy student anyway. As many have pointed out, what is important is that you are able to live with yourself. If you still feel bad, why not consider donating a portion of your stipend to a needy student fund or to charities?

Yes I intend to donate some money to syrian refugees. We are full of refugees here. I mean I probably won't pay much but I will help them monthly so that will be a good thing

 

[bcrowell]

Yeah, you were a spoiled child (compared to them), they weren't. You said it yourself that they have struggled with money their entire life. Then you walk in as the child of a doctor and you start bragging about how you played the system and obtained 4 scholarships and maybe even a fifth one. [...] You're not supposed to have it and you're taking away the opportunity of another student to get an education.

This seems much, much too harsh to me. As far as I can tell these are merit-based scholarships and very competitive. The fact that he won them probably means that he showed exceptional academic merit. He could choose to give back some of the money, but I don't see that as any kind of a moral imperative.

There is lots of illogic and inefficiency in the way various societies subsidize education as a public good. The fact that merit-based scholarships may be awarded independently of one another is arguably such an inefficiency, but it isn't a huge one in the big picture, and it's certainly not a moral issue on the individual level. A real example of inefficiency would be the fact that the state of California spends 7 billion dollars per year on its community college system, providing approximately a 75% subsidy, and yet the community college success rate is only about 10% (by various measures such as achieving a stated goal of transferring to a four-year school within 5 years). If there is a moral imperative for the OP to give back his scholarship money, then there is a vastly greater moral imperative for millions of middle-class community college dropouts to give back to the state the money that it wasted trying to educate them.

Yes I intend to donate some money to syrian refugees. We are full of refugees here. I mean I probably won't pay much but I will help them monthly so that will be a good thing

Good for you. You seem like a very compassionate and moral person.

 

[Dr. Courtney]

There is lots of illogic and inefficiency in the way various societies subsidize education as a public good. The fact that merit-based scholarships may be awarded independently of one another is arguably such an inefficiency, but it isn't a huge one in the big picture, and it's certainly not a moral issue on the individual level. A real example of inefficiency would be the fact that the state of California spends 7 billion dollars per year on its community college system, providing approximately a 75% subsidy, and yet the community college success rate is only about 10% (by various measures such as achieving a stated goal of transferring to a four-year school within 5 years). If there is a moral imperative for the OP to give back his scholarship money, then there is a vastly greater moral imperative for millions of middle-class community college dropouts to give back to the state the money that it wasted trying to educate them.

Wow, someone actually wrote that. I certainly agree.

The most immoral and wasteful thing I see in public education is lazy students who never really intend to work hard and learn avoiding real life by pretending to seek an education on the taxpayer's dime.

Of course, the profs and administrators who allow them to are even greater moral failures than the lazy students.

 

[StatGuy2000]

Yeah well. Scholarships are supposed to help the poor. So you taking these scholarships means some other poor guy might not be able to complete his education because of money issues. Sure, go ahead and take the money. Everybody would. But don't try and feel like a "good" person at the same time. Not that it's entirely your fault that those organizations didn't check that you already had several scholarships. But it sure isn't exactly a very moral thing to do.

micromass, you have often expressed views of which I agree with, but on this front I would have to respectfully (but strongly) disagree. Contrary to what you have expressed above, the primary purpose of scholarships (unlike bursaries or grants which are provided to students for that very purpose) are not to help the poor, but to reward hard-working and talented students to continue to pursue higher education (some scholarships are tied to studying specific subjects, others are more broad-based). In other words, scholarships are by their very definition merit-based, and it is quite common in Canada and the US to be awarded more than one scholarship.

So long as the OP was eligible for being awarded that scholarship, then he is fully deserving of that scholarship, and he has absolutely no reason whatsoever in returning it. He earned it "fair and square" and has nothing to be ashamed of (unlike your assertions in this post). I agree with the other posters that his supposed "friends" who expressed anger and jealousy are not really his friends -- a true friend would be happy and supportive of his successes, not resentful. And I am frankly disappointed that you feel otherwise.

 

[micromass]

micromass, you have often expressed views of which I agree with, but on this front I would have to respectfully (but strongly) disagree. Contrary to what you have expressed above, the primary purpose of scholarships (unlike bursaries or grants which are provided to students for that very purpose) are not to help the poor, but to reward hard-working and talented students to continue to pursue higher education (some scholarships are tied to studying specific subjects, others are more broad-based). In other words, scholarships are by their very definition merit-based, and it is quite common in Canada and the US to be awarded more than one scholarship.

Well, I'm sorry then as I did not understand how scholarships worked over there. In my country, we have scholarships but they are strictly need based and never merit based. Never. It's good that I understand more about this now, so I won't make the same mistake again.

I agree with the other posters that his supposed "friends" who expressed anger and jealousy are not really his friends -- a true friend would be happy and supportive of his successes, not resentful. And I am frankly disappointed that you feel otherwise.

I never said the friends were not to blame though. I think behaving like they did is not good. But I also remark that we don't have the full story. We only have the OP's version of the story, which is what he thinks and feels about the situation. I was trying to invent some reasons for why his friends behaved this ways. Sure, his friends may be genuine a**oles (as is what the OP makes it appear). But they might have other reasons for behaving this way. For example, they might be just teasing him and the OP might take it too seriously. Or like I explained, they might feel bad because they're struggling financially and he gets 4 scholarships. The behavior of the friends is certainly not cool. But he shouldn't immediately drop them. He should talk to them and figure out what's going on.

I stay with my statement never to talk about financial issues outside immediate family though. But my scholarship remarks were wrong and misguided. I do however question a system where somebody can get 4 scholarships of 1000's of dollars just like that...

 

[StatGuy2000]

Well, I'm sorry then as I did not understand how scholarships worked over there. In my country, we have scholarships but they are strictly need based and never merit based. Never. It's good that I understand more about this now, so I won't make the same mistake again.

OK, I see where you are coming from, because I am aware that in some countries university funding to students is purely need-based (more along the lines of bursaries of grants as I've stated before). So I can see why you think it isn't truly moral. In Canada, student funding often comes with a mix of merit-based scholarships, grants and bursaries, and student loans, so that was the frame of reference I was thinking of. Hopefully I didn't sound too harsh to you -- it's an honest misunderstanding. All is good! :)

I never said the friends were not to blame though. I think behaving like they did is not good. But I also remark that we don't have the full story. We only have the OP's version of the story, which is what he thinks and feels about the situation. I was trying to invent some reasons for why his friends behaved this ways. Sure, his friends may be genuine a**oles (as is what the OP makes it appear). But they might have other reasons for behaving this way. For example, they might be just teasing him and the OP might take it too seriously. Or like I explained, they might feel bad because they're struggling financially and he gets 4 scholarships. The behavior of the friends is certainly not cool. But he shouldn't immediately drop them. He should talk to them and figure out what's going on.

Yes, I do agree with you that we only have the perspective of the OP on this. In my response I was basically taking the OP's statement at face value (not knowing the posters personally, that is the general position I take with any new posts unless something in the post leads me to strongly question what the poster has stated). At the same time, any possible reasons either you or I state about the reaction of his friends is essentially speculation (we have no idea whether his friends are actually struggling financially, nor if his friends are merely teasing him in the way friends often do -- the fact that the OP is troubled by his friends' responses frankly suggest otherwise for the latter). Whether the OP should drop his friends is his choice, but if they are genuinely resentful a**oles, then he deserves better friends.

 

[Dishsoap]

Why would you discourage talking about financial issues outside of family? Something like winning a scholarship or getting a raise has attached to it much more "value" than merely financial - would you not tell your friends that you won a prestigious award just because there was money attached to it?

 

[atyy]

Yes I did check everything and I actually talked to the foundation that granted me, they know that I am getting a big scholarship from the gvt I don't think they care

I presume you also checked with the govt (and all the other scholarships) that each is ok with you having multiple scholarships? If they are fine with that, then there is nothing wrong with what you are doing.

 

[micromass]

Why would you discourage talking about financial issues outside of family? Something like winning a scholarship or getting a raise has attached to it much more "value" than merely financial - would you not tell your friends that you won a prestigious award just because there was money attached to it?

Getting a raise at my job? No, I would never talk about that to my friends. And I clearly don't understand the scholarship thing, but isn't it very different from an award? Of course I will mention an award, but a scholarship seems to be people helping you with money. I would not talk about that for sure.

Again, this might be a cultural issue. We really don't like to talk about stuff like that because we see it as bragging. I once won an award at my university for being the best student in the entire university. I didn't tell anybody about this.

 

[Dishsoap]

Getting a raise at my job? No, I would never talk about that to my friends. And I clearly don't understand the scholarship thing, but isn't it very different from an award? Of course I will mention an award, but a scholarship seems to be people helping you with money. I would not talk about that for sure.

I guess my experience as an undergrad so far is that the line between "scholarship" and "award" is very fine, which is something I hadn't previously thought about. When I entered as a freshman, I got a nice scholarship, but as an entering freshman I hadn't really done anything to deserve it besides doing well on some standardized tests, and volunteering. The primary virtue of that accomplishment is that it comes with money, so I'd call it a scholarship.

On the contrary, getting an award like you did, being the best student in the university (congratulations, by the way), is important to you not because it came with money (assuming it did), but because getting it means you're the best damn student in the entire university! Similarly, I won a national award a few years ago for doing research as an undergrad, and the money that came with it was non-negligible, yet I consider it to be an "award" because I would have still been quite proud even if no money had come with it.

I might be rambling a bit, but you raise an interesting point: I wonder if the difference between a scholarship and an award is the importance (not the value) of the money that comes with it - whether it exists to recognize someone for an accomplishment, or to help them pay for school. I don't know :)

 

[micromass]

On the contrary, getting an award like you did, being the best student in the university (congratulations, by the way), is important to you not because it came with money (assuming it did)

Well, it came with 15 euros haha. I couldn't even spend it anywhere, I had to spend it at the official shop of the university. I think it's very clear we don't like to spend money for awards like this. We only really spend money for people in need. I find this way more logical actually than somebody being able to get 4 scholarships because of good grades. But hey, if the system works like this...

But yeah, in the case of awards, I'd have to agree with Feynman

I might be rambling a bit, but you raise an interesting point: I wonder if the difference between a scholarship and an award is the importance (not the value) of the money that comes with it - whether it exists to recognize someone for an accomplishment, or to help them pay for school. I don't know :)

Yeah, I don't really understand this entire scholarship system...

 

[Student100]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

 

[Dishsoap]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

I'm not sure that taking OP on a guilt trip is the way to go. I think it's safe to say that the situation is morally ambiguous - if OP feels bad about taking it, then he/she should give it back. Clearly he does, so that is the best choice.

 

[micromass]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

It's cultural I guess. The OP doesn't really have much expenses and has 4 scholarships. I would feel very guilty with that. But apparently, the culture of the OP makes it more acceptable.

 

[Student100]

It's cultural I guess. The OP doesn't really have much expenses and has 4 scholarships. I would feel very guilty with that. But apparently, the culture of the OP makes it more acceptable.

I guess, he still seems troubled by it which is a good thing.

I couldn't sleep at night knowing I've gamed the system in such a way, but then again, to each his own.

 

[Cruz Martinez]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

Exactly, the question of whether it is worse to get financial help and waste it by being lazy is worse than getting a lot of money out of merit does not change the fact that there will be students in actual NEED of that money, and with comparable merit, who won't get it, because someone has 4 scholarships which he does not strictly need.

 

[Dr. Courtney]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

In the US, there are many more need based scholarships than merit based scholarships, and those with true needs will almost always find all the financial aid they need to attend college at a big state university if they can get in. It is unrealistic to suggest that someone who accepts merit based scholarships might be depriving someone who needs the money. Most of the money in merit based scholarships is spent attracting the best students to particular schools and/or attracting and retaining the best students to particular fields, and there are almost always stipulations: attending a specific school, majoring in a specific field, and maintaining a certain GPA. Most merit based scholarships require one to maintain a 3.0 or higher GPA; whereas, most need based scholarships only require maintaining a 2.0.

If there was a student just as deserving for a merit scholarship, odds are they would have been awarded the scholarship also.

 

[Utilite]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

See, three of my scholarships are just given to some people. If you have the criteria to get it, then you get it. It doesn't affect other people. The last one however, given by a foundation is a limited scholarship. Around 1.500 people applied and I got to last 40. I think I deserved it. And that foundation also grants need based scholarship.
The only thing is I am probably taking away someones vacation money as my own. I mean I can afford a vacation, they probably can't.
I think what disturbs me is, I am saving the money. No of the people at my age make this money unless they invent stuff or write a book or something. I am literally doing nothing and I am saving money. Does this make me a dick?

 

[micromass]

I think what disturbs me is, I am saving the money. No of the people at my age make this money unless they invent stuff or write a book or something. I am literally doing nothing and I am saving money. Does this make me a dick?

You seem to be under the weird impression that it is what you do with the money that would make it immoral. Like you keep saying that you don't spend it and you feel bad because of that. What makes it immoral is not that at all. It is rather you not needing the money, and taking it away from somebody else who might need it to afford an education. Sure, it is clear that in three of the scholarships, this is not the case as they would have given it to everybody who met the criteria. But the fourth one is different. You don't need the money, but you got it anyway. However you spend it is really not an issue.

The only thing is I am probably taking away someones vacation money as my own. I mean I can afford a vacation, they probably can't.

Why do you think you're taking away someone's vacation money? You think this is what it is, vacation money? Maybe people actually need this money to survive and afford an education, and it's not just vacation money...

 

[D H]

I'm going to go against the grain of most of the other answers, @Utilite, and say that the ones you are hurting most are your parents.

Take your scholarships without grief, but earn them. The way you earn them as a student is to be as good a student as those merit-based scholarship organizations think you will be. If you're as good as they think you are, you (or someone who capitalizes on your brilliant ideas) will eventually be donating lots and lots of money to those organizations. That's the bet on which those scholarship organizations are gambling.

With regard to your student friends, the best path to joining them on a scholarship-free path through college is to use those scholarship monies to PARTY! This is not a good path. Another one of your responsibilities as a highly gifted person is to help those who are of just above-average intelligence see how to solve problems. Even if you don't get rich or don't have fantastically lucrative ideas, that your intuitive insight might help create a billionaire (who would otherwise have been mediocre) is another one of those gambles made by those merit-based scholarship organizations.

On the other hand, your parents most likely didn't take that African Safari, a trip to the Americas, or go to New Zealand and Australia because they had you as a child and because they had limited finances. You are taking advantage of your parents by taking their money when you do not need it. Now is the time (before they die) for them to take those trips they have long longed to take, but without you and your siblings in tow. Let them do that by telling them that you don't need their money to get through college.

 

[Student100]

In the US, there are many more need based scholarships than merit based scholarships, and those with true needs will almost always find all the financial aid they need to attend college at a big state university if they can get in. It is unrealistic to suggest that someone who accepts merit based scholarships might be depriving someone who needs the money. Most of the money in merit based scholarships is spent attracting the best students to particular schools and/or attracting and retaining the best students to particular fields, and there are almost always stipulations: attending a specific school, majoring in a specific field, and maintaining a certain GPA. Most merit based scholarships require one to maintain a 3.0 or higher GPA; whereas, most need based scholarships only require maintaining a 2.0.

If there was a student just as deserving for a merit scholarship, odds are they would have been awarded the scholarship also.

I'm not sure why you believe this is true. The massive amount of student debt in the US says anything but this.

 

[Utilite]

I'm going to go against the grain of most of the other answers, @Utilite, and say that the ones you are hurting most are your parents.
On the other hand, your parents most likely didn't take that African Safari, a trip to the Americas, or go to New Zealand and Australia because they had you as a child and because they had limited finances. You are taking advantage of your parents by taking their money when you do not need it. Now is the time (before they die) for them to take those trips they have long longed to take, but without you and your siblings in tow. Let them do that by telling them that you don't need their money to get through college.

See, I am insisting for my parents to enjoy their retirement more but I guess they are like me. They stay home all the time... My father takes care of my grandfather and the house and my mother knits and cooks and stuff like that. She from time to time visits her sisters at a different city. My father didn't even leave the country, he has some kind of flight phobia. I guess I am just like them only younger.
@micromass I pretty sure that I am not hurting those who really need the money because government almost always helps those need the money and successful enough to earn this scholarship. Also by vacation money I meant money they could just spend buying stuff and partying or even save some up. This is not the kind of scholarship designed for students to pay up the college debt.

 

[jim hardy]

Somebody said it already -
Just measure up to the expectations of your benefactors.
Use the money sparingly, live a no frills lifestyle, and when you graduate turn what's left back into the institution that gave it to you so they can help somebody else. Dissipation doesn't lead to a successful life.

Image courtesy Leanin' Tree cards
http://www.leanintree.com/personalized-birthday-card-2001254-p.htmlmy two cents

old jim

 

[Dr. Courtney]

I'm not sure why you believe this is true. The massive amount of student debt in the US says anything but this.

The accumulation of debt does not necessarily indicate need, it indicates people who desire to live beyond their means.

A student can easily add $12,000 per year to their college expenses simply by attending a college where they cannot live at home. This may be necessary in some cases, but most of the US population lives within commuting distance of schools which provide very cost effective education for the first two years, and distance learning programs are also rapidly growing.

Many students also accumulate great debt by eschewing more cost effective schools with in-state tuition and choosing to go into debt to attend private schools and schools in other states.

Another factor that contributes to debt accumulation is students screw around and take 5-6 years to earn degrees that are reasonably earned in 4 years. That's a lot of additional debt and delay in starting to repay it.

In any given case, it's not hard to sit down with a student and craft a college education plan with very little or no debt. But in many cases, they need to be willing to live at home (at least for the first two years), need to work hard, need to live frugally, and need to make the most cost effective choices rather than being more motivated to get out from their parents' watchful eyes to drink, party, and screw around.

 

[Student100]

The accumulation of debt does not necessarily indicate need, it indicates people who desire to live beyond their means.

A student can easily add $12,000 per year to their college expenses simply by attending a college where they cannot live at home. This may be necessary in some cases, but most of the US population lives within commuting distance of schools which provide very cost effective education for the first two years, and distance learning programs are also rapidly growing.

Many students also accumulate great debt by eschewing more cost effective schools with in-state tuition and choosing to go into debt to attend private schools and schools in other states.

Another factor that contributes to debt accumulation is students screw around and take 5-6 years to earn degrees that are reasonably earned in 4 years. That's a lot of additional debt and delay in starting to repay it.

In any given case, it's not hard to sit down with a student and craft a college education plan with very little or no debt. But in many cases, they need to be willing to live at home (at least for the first two years), need to work hard, need to live frugally, and need to make the most cost effective choices rather than being more motivated to get out from their parents' watchful eyes to drink, party, and screw around.

This is a gross over simplification. Let's look at where I went to school, UCSD, 2015-2016 tuition & budgeting estimates for students who live at home is currently 25,200. I don't know personally very many people who could afford that without supplementing with student loans. Even the most frugal students will be out 20,000 when tuition, books, supplies, parking permits, transportation etc, are accounted for. This is for students who live with their parents.

Without the GI bill I could have never went to school. My parents are simply poor, with no money to spare for such things. Not to mention I lived in the rural south, and the closest in state school was two hours away. Even with the GI bill I took on about 10,000 in debt, while working, attending a community college for the first two years and having a savings before I quit my job to attend university.

Maybe students could get by without loans when you went to school, I doubt for very many students this is realistic anymore.

 

[Dr. Courtney]

This is a gross over simplification. Let's look at where I went to school, UCSD, 2015-2016 tuition & budgeting estimates for students who live at home is currently 25,200.

You didn't live within driving distance of a community college? There are lots of community colleges in the San Diego area.

If you didn't qualify for need based aid, why weren't your parents willing to help with expenses?

How much of that $4,698 UCSD figures for housing and meals of students living with their parents did you actually spend or repay to your parents?

How much of that $1833 figured for health insurance did you actually repay to your parents if they kept you on their insurance? How many students who actually need to provide their own health insurance will not qualify for need-based aid (grants and scholarships) that do not need to be repaid)?

Or are you being dishonest with the notion that a student living with their parents actually needs to come up with anywhere near $25k a year to attend college in the San Diego area? Several affordable schools in the area require cash out of pocket much closer to $8k per year.

If you cannot afford a top 25 school, do not attend a top 25 school. One should not blame someone who accepts a merit based scholarship for their own inability to live beyond their means. Post four semesters of 4.0 GPAs at a more humble institution, and get the profs to write you great letters of recommendation. You will be able to afford your junior and senior years.

There are some rural areas that are not within commuting distance of affordable schools, but there is now a plethora of distance learning options available at community college prices. Many schools even charge in-state tuition rates for distance learning courses taken by students in other states - some as low as $5k-$6k a year for a full time course load.

 

[Evo]

Time to say goodbye to this thread as it has gone off topic.