If you look a bit foreign, don't do math on a plane

[ZapperZ]

This is way too stupid to make up:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...d-for-doing-math-on-american-airlines-flight/

Zz.

 

[Borg]

Clearly she came to a conclusion that just didn't add up.

 

[Isaac0427]

The curly-haired man was, the agent informed him politely, suspected of terrorism.

The curly-haired man laughed.

He laughed because those scribbles weren’t Arabic, or some other terrorist code. They were math.

Yes, math. A differential equation, to be exact.

I agree, this is too stupid to be made up .

 

[micromass]

Does economy really qualify as math??

 

[fresh_42]

The American paranoia isn't just famous, it's also increasing! Must be very unpleasant to fear everybody you meet around the clock.

 

[fresh_42]

Does economy really qualify as math??

Microeconomics, hmm, perhaps not, but macroeconomics without math is simply empty.

 

[ogg]

The female passenger is the one who should have been detained for raising the alarm without any valid rationale. Hopefully, she will be barred from any future air flight. If not, then ignorance wins. This seems to me to be EXACTLY an example of unreasonable and unjustified search and seizure. The fact that the airline took action with zero valid justification should be heavily sanctioned. Perhaps a $10 million dollar fine per incident, would do the trick. Oh, and make sure that any appeal be handled by an arbitration judge who is compensated with a % of the fine. Ignorance is not a valid excuse, even if the Washington Post abuses the dumb blonde (sexist) stereotype, again.

 

[russ_watters]

Does economy really qualify as math??

I'm reasonably certain differential equations are a tool of evil.

 

[russ_watters]

The female passenger is the one who should have been detained for raising the alarm without any valid rationale. Hopefully, she will be barred from any future air flight.

I'm not sure I agree. She's dumb, sure, but I'm not sure it is a good idea to strongly discourage people from speaking-up. Usually, there isn't enough of that.

This seems to me to be EXACTLY an example of unreasonable and unjustified search and seizure.

As far as I can tell, there were no searches or seizures involved here, but even if there had been a search, it wouldn't have been unreasonable: everything you have is subject to search on an airline flight.

The fact that the airline took action with zero valid justification should be heavily sanctioned.

Disagree. The airline has a responsibility to the safety of its passengers and their bar for pro-active protection of safety is extremely high.

 

[Ygggdrasil]

This is way too stupid to make up:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...d-for-doing-math-on-american-airlines-flight/

Zz.

It was at one point a joke going around on the internet: http://www.ms.uky.edu/~jrge/340/Weapons_of_Math_Instruction.html

At New York’s Kennedy airport today, a person later discovered to be a public school teacher, was arrested trying to board a flight while in possession of a ruler, a protractor, a drafting triangle, a compass, and a calculator.

During a press conference the Attorney General said he believed the man was a member of the notorious al-Gebra movement and the FBI intends to charge him with transporting weapons of math instruction.

 

[fresh_42]

I'm reasonably certain differential equations are a tool of evil.

Uhmm, ..., you know that your avatar shows someone next to an instrument which is supposed to stare a the biggest differential equation we know of?

 

[micromass]

Uhmm, ..., you know that your avatar shows someone next to an instrument which is supposed to stare a the biggest differential equation we know of?

Why do you think we spend so much time staring at it? Because it's evil!

 

[DiracPool]

It was at one point a joke going around on the internet: http://www.ms.uky.edu/~jrge/340/Weapons_of_Math_Instruction.html

You can put somebody's eye out with a compass!

As far as the terrorist, I'd be looking for dangling fuses hanging out of his shoes or Gatorade bottle. If he's just starting to mathematically work out the kinetics of his explosive device during the refreshment service on a 41 minute flight, I wouldn't worry too much about it.

 

[Psinter]

Spoiler: Facepalm

A[/PLAIN] facepalm (sometimes also face-palm or face palm) is the physical gesture of placing one's hand flat across one's face or lowering one's face into one's hand or hands, covering or closing the eyes. The gesture is found in many cultures as a display of frustration, disappointment, exasperation, embarrassment, horror,[2] shock, surprise, exhaustion, or sarcasm.

What does the scouter says about her education level? That she's lacking a little in the math department.

My math isn't awesome, but at least I recognize differential equations.

 

[fresh_42]

Happily it has been only mathematics and he wasn't dealing with radicals. Imagine a chemist dealing with (free!) radicals!

 

[mathwonk]

remember this 2001 garry trudeau cartoon?

http://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/2001/10/09

 

[atyy]

Very educated woman Lots of maths is Arabic. Algebra is. Edmund Halley learned Arabic.

 

[StevieTNZ]

This is utterly appalling. Racism at its best.

 

[StatGuy2000]

I'm reasonably certain differential equations are a tool of evil.

So I take it that differential equations was not your favorite class in college?

 

[StatGuy2000]

Oh, dear. Where to begin?

As I understand from the article, the woman on the plane thought that the man sitting beside her on the plane was suspicious because (1) he had an accent, (2) he looked "Middle Eastern", and (3) he was scribbling something on a piece of paper.

First, since when does a foreign accent and looking "Middle Eastern" sufficient for the man being suspicious? The man wasn't even Middle Eastern, he is Italian!

Second, since when does writing on a piece of paper constitute a threat? Even if the man was writing something in Arabic script (which, btw, may not necessarily be Arabic -- it could be Farsi, Urdu, or any number of other languages), chances are that whatever he was writing was probably innocuous -- he could have been writing a letter to his mother! At any rate, how dangerous is someone with a pen, anyways?

Third, has this woman never taken math in school in her life? She may not know what a differential equation is, but she should know what an equation is, and should know that it's not a foreign script. After all, we write equations using the Latin alphabet, with occasional Greek letters!

 

[phinds]

Third, has this woman never taken math in school in her life? She may not know what a differential equation is, but she should know what an equation is, and should know that it's not a foreign script. After all, we write equations using the Latin alphabet, with occasional Greek letters!

You vastly overestimate the math knowledge of the average American. I think it's common for people who understand math at least through trig and calculus to do that and even more so for people who know more advanced math.

 

[StatGuy2000]

You vastly overestimate the math knowledge of the average American. I think it's common for people who understand math at least through trig and calculus to do that and even more so for people who know more advanced math.

I'm from Canada, and there are many people here in this country whose math knowledge is minimal at best, so I don't expect the average American to be any better or worse in that regard. And I didn't expect her to understand the equations he was writing, but at the same time, anyone who can read should know that what the man was writing was not a foreign script. I don't think that's too much to expect of an average American, is it?

 

[phinds]

I'm from Canada, and there are many people here in this country whose math knowledge is minimal at best, so I don't expect the average American to be any better or worse in that regard. And I didn't expect her to understand the equations he was writing, but at the same time, anyone who can read should know that what the man was writing was not a foreign script. I don't think that's too much to expect of an average American, is it?

Probably. I've known college graduates who could not identify what the integral symbol means and probably were not sure if it was part of a foreign script. It looks Arabic after all. AND, 60% of adult Americans have not graduated from college.

 

[micromass]

Probably. I've known college graduates who could not identify what the integral symbol means and probably were not sure if it was part of a foreign script. It looks Arabic after all. AND, 60% of adult Americans have not graduated from college.

Really? Does something like $\int_1^2 \sqrt{1 - x^2}dx$ look similar to بشرية النفط الأعمال كل وتم. عن وبداية بالمطالبة وفي, تصرّف الأخذ جهة بل. وجزر شموليةً لكل ان, جسيمة الموسوعة ضرب عن, تم بحشد حلّت الخاسرة دار. لم أمام وانهاء وبالتحديد، تلك. تم تلك حادثة الإطلاق.

Even if you don't know integrals, I think the difference between math and arabic is pretty obvious.

 

[phinds]

Really? Does something like $\int_1^2 \sqrt{1 - x^2}dx$ look similar to بشرية النفط الأعمال كل وتم. عن وبداية بالمطالبة وفي, تصرّف الأخذ جهة بل. وجزر شموليةً لكل ان, جسيمة الموسوعة ضرب عن, تم بحشد حلّت الخاسرة دار. لم أمام وانهاء وبالتحديد، تلك. تم تلك حادثة الإطلاق.

Even if you don't know integrals, I think the difference between math and arabic is pretty obvious.

Yes, I think so too, but obviously this lady didn't and I don't think she's even close to being alone. After all, I doubt if she really looked at it. Something like an integral sign probably jumped out at her and she then jumped to the wrong conclusion. I just don't find it all that surprising.

 

[micromass]

Yes, I think so too, but obviously this lady didn't and I don't think she's even close to being alone.

I don't trust this article at all. I think some parts are exaggerated and there are things they're not telling us. And until I hear from the lady herself, I refuse to believe that she thought math was arabic.

 

[fresh_42]

... but she should know what an equation is, and should know that it's not a foreign script.

Oh you awesome naive innocent person. ... not a foreign script ... You can't even imagine how foreign this is. And not restricted to the USA.

 

[phinds]

I don't trust this article at all. I think some parts are exaggerated and there are things they're not telling us. And until I hear from the lady herself, I refuse to believe that she thought math was arabic.

I just don't see why you find it hard to believe that a significant number of Americans could confuse a few higher math symbols for a foreign script.

various polls show that about 40% of Americans believe in ghosts. This one says 45%
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/02/real-ghosts-americans-poll_n_2049485.html

various polls show that about 40% of Americans believe that Aliens have visited Earth. This one says 36%
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/ufos-exist-americans-national-geographic-survey/story?id=16661311

various polls show that over 50% of Americans believe in angels. This one says 77%
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/poll-nearly-8-in-10-americans-believe-in-angels/

And don't even get me started on religion, Creationism, etc.

 

[micromass]

I just don't see why you find it hard to believe that a significant number of Americans could confuse a few higher math symbols for a foreign script.

various polls show that about 40% of Americans believe in ghosts. This one says 45%
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/02/real-ghosts-americans-poll_n_2049485.html

various polls show that about 40% of Americans believe that Aliens have visited Earth. This one says 36%
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/ufos-exist-americans-national-geographic-survey/story?id=16661311

various polls show that over 50% of Americans believe in angels. This one says 77%
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/poll-nearly-8-in-10-americans-believe-in-angels/

And don't even get me started on religion, Creationism, etc.

I don't see how any of that is relevant to distinguishing math from arabic.

 

[fresh_42]

I doubt that a significant number of Americans have the slightest idea of how arabic may look like.

 

[micromass]

I doubt that a significant number of Americans have the slightest idea of how arabic may look like.

Really? Everybody who watches the news and sees all these "terror groups" has seen some arabic.

 

[fresh_42]

Really? Everybody who watches the news and sees all these "terror groups" has seen some arabic.

The Americans I know draw another picture of the common knowledge of the average American.
Edit: I doubt it's any better over here. Some special issues excluded for the rate of contamination is by the nature of our societies a higher one.

 

[micromass]

Well all of this is anecdotal anyway. I would be very interested in a serious study where american citizens need to distinguish different "languages" and where it turns out they can't distinguish math from arabic. Maybe you're right, and they can't. I doubt that. But until they seriously investigated it, I'm not going to pick a side.

 

[fresh_42]

In radio shows they sometimes do random street polls and ask people simple questions like: What's the highest position in the state? How long does it take the Earth to orbit the sun? What does <any latin originated word> mean?
I regularly have to change the channel because I can't stand the answers.
(Of course I know they cut in the especially stupid ones. However, they occur and are seemingly not hard to find.)

 

[Vanadium 50]

At any rate, how dangerous is someone with a pen, anyways?

The pen is mightier than the sword.

 

[Borg]

This discussion reminds me of a similar incident that I had in college. I was visiting a friend and was also working on some differential equations. I accidently left the paper at his house and by the time that I remembered a couple of days later, his babysitter had thrown it out. She thought that it was paper that the four-year-old had been scribbling on. I never did recover those warp drive equations...

 

[micromass]

This discussion reminds me of a similar incident that I had in college. I was visiting a friend and was also working on some differential equations. I accidently left the paper at his house and by the time that I remembered a couple of days later, his babysitter had thrown it out. She thought that it was paper that the four-year-old had been scribbling on. I never did recover those warp drive equations...

Differential equations again...

 

[fresh_42]

The pen is mightier than the sword.

 

[fresh_42]

This discussion reminds me of a similar incident that I had in college. I was visiting a friend and was also working on some differential equations. I accidently left the paper at his house and by the time that I remembered a couple of days later, his babysitter had thrown it out. She thought that it was paper that the four-year-old had been scribbling on. I never did recover those warp drive equations...

How could you? I assume it were a low energy solution ...
A friend of mine once cleared a table (economists at the table) in a crowded bistro by placing his book on differentials and integrals on it ...

 

[DrDu]

As a chemist, I have to say that it has become impossible to do even the most harmless experiments without getting suspicious and attracting interest from police. The paranoid regulations in the chemistry forum here don't form an exception. It is only consequent that doing math outside university premises is considered a possible act of terrorism. Soon practicing music without being a professional musician and outside a concert hall will be prosecuted, too.

 

[Ben Niehoff]

Algebra akbar!

 

[Ben Niehoff]

Really? Does something like $\int_1^2 \sqrt{1 - x^2}dx$ look similar to بشرية النفط الأعمال كل وتم. عن وبداية بالمطالبة وفي, تصرّف الأخذ جهة بل. وجزر شموليةً لكل ان, جسيمة الموسوعة ضرب عن, تم بحشد حلّت الخاسرة دار. لم أمام وانهاء وبالتحديد، تلك. تم تلك حادثة الإطلاق.

Even if you don't know integrals, I think the difference between math and arabic is pretty obvious.

She was probably using Arabic numerals!

 

[StatGuy2000]

As a chemist, I have to say that it has become impossible to do even the most harmless experiments without getting suspicious and attracting interest from police. The paranoid regulations in the chemistry forum here don't form an exception. It is only consequent that doing math outside university premises is considered a possible act of terrorism. Soon practicing music without being a professional musician and outside a concert hall will be prosecuted, too.

In the case of chemistry, I can at least see why experiments can arouse suspicion, given that ingredients used for experiments can also be used to create bombs (the same can be said for those doing experiments with microbes).

But math?? How can proving theorems or writing a math formula in itself lead to anything that is threatening?

 

[DrDu]

Theoreticians are always suspect and threatening to systems. They have strong analytic skills often also outside their speciality and use a language which is incomprehensible to most politicians. This did cost many lives e.g. in stalinistic russia.

 

[StatGuy2000]

Theoreticians are always suspect and threatening to systems. They have strong analytic skills often also outside their speciality and use a language which is incomprehensible to most politicians. This did cost many lives e.g. in stalinistic russia.

In totalitarian regimes, any intellectual (including mathematicians or those with strong mathematical skills) are strongly suspect, so it would not surprise me that those with such backgrounds often faced persecution or oppression.

But more specifically to the point of being suspected of being a terrorist -- how can writing something on a piece of paper (whether it be a letter in Arabic, or writing a math formula) be reasonably be thought of as being in any way threatening or suspicious, without knowing more about the individuals involved?

 

[Cruz Martinez]

Even if things like integral signs and perhaps some greek letters might seem like a strange string of symbols, i cannot believe that this woman didn't see an equality symbol or a plus or minus sign and then recognized it was math that the man was writing. This story is hard to take at face value.

 

[fresh_42]

Even if things like integral signs and perhaps some greek letters might seem like a strange string of symbols, i cannot believe that this woman didn't see an equality symbol or a plus or minus sign and then recognized it was math that the man was writing. This story is hard to take at face value.

Usually the WP is a reliable source, so it should be true.

 

[zoobyshoe]

After having mulled this story over for a few days, I end up thinking this woman was not merely stupid. I get the feeling there was a pathological need for attention motivating her. Something like this, maybe:

Munchausen syndrome is a psychiatric factitious disorder wherein those affected feign disease, illness, or psychological trauma to draw attention, sympathy, or reassurance to themselves.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munchausen_syndrome

In other words, this was probably about her seeing and grabbing an opportunity to have the airlines, and maybe law enforcement, heaping attention and reassurance on her after the 'psychological trauma' of thinking she was sitting next to a terrorist.

On the other hand, it could have been a straightforward case of classic paranoia on her part. In any event, I don't take her motivation at face value. Like micromass said, everyone knows what middle eastern languages look like, even if you don't read them, and by the same token everyone has seen a thousand movies and TV shows where blackboards are covered with 'complicated math'. Everyone has a sense of what that looks like, even when you can't make heads or tails of it.

 

[Cruz Martinez]

Usually the WP is a reliable source, so it should be true.

I do not know that. In any case, I am not saying the incident itself did't happen.

 

[fresh_42]

I get the feeling there was a pathological need for attention motivating her.

An interesting point of view. It reminds me on something similar. It's been a short flight on a monday morning from Frankfurt to London. You must know that these two cities are basically the two financial headquarters of Europe. So on a monday morning there are almost all (please don't read this expression mathematically) seats taken by bankers and brokers. All in black suits, all with laptops and only a few with baggage. It's more like a bus trip to work than it is a flight of about 90 minutes. Next to me happened to sit a lady who was obviously nobody of the usual clientele. (She has been blonde, I can't deny that.) She started her day by drinking champagne the whole flight through. As we had landed in HTR, she started to clap her hands and applauded the pilots. Of course she was the only person in this full cabin who did so. I found it embarrassing but perhaps she suffered a similar ADH disorder.