In what class does one typically learn that atoms emit EM radiation?

  • #1
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Summary:
Hydrogen emits electromagnetic radiation at 1420 MHz.

Does one typically learn that all atoms emit electromagnetic radiation all time in Inorganic Chemistry Class, Organic Chemistry class, or in physics class?
I took Inorganic Chemistry I and Physics in high school. I took Inorganic Chemistry I and about half of Inorganic Chemistry II (dropped out mid-semster of Inorganic Chemistry II) in college. My Physics class in high school was just regular physics, not AP Physics, so I have never taken a college level physics class in my life. I also have never taken a class on Organic Chemistry in my life.

I learned that hydrogen atoms emit electromagnetic radiation from reading Paul Davies book The Eerie Silence. I did not learn that all hydrogen atoms or virtually all hydrogen atoms emit electromagnetic radiation from any of the chemistry or physics classes that I took in high school or college. I read The Eerie Silence years after I had completed school.

My understanding is that all or virtually all hydrogen atoms emit electromagnetic radiation all the time at the frequency of 1420 MHz. I believe that all atoms or virtually all atoms of all elements emit electromagnetic radiation all the time.

For people who learned in school or college that all or virtually all hydrogen atoms and other atoms emit electromagnetic radiation all the time, in what class did you learn this? Did you learn that all hydrogen atoms emit electromagnetic radiation all the time in Inorganic Chemistry or in Organic Chemistry or in Physics class? Was this in high school or college that you learned this?


__________________________________________________________________________________________

I was a good student before I took Inorganic Chemistry II. I am curious as to why I never learned this in the chemistry and physics classes I took in high school and college.
 

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  • #2
Borek
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So you are saying in all your courses you were never introduced to Bohr atom model and Rydberg formula? Things like hydrogen spectral series?
 
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  • #3
mjc123
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It is not true that all atoms emit EM radiation all the time. Most atoms don't emit radiation most of the time. But if you have a large enough mass of gas, there will always be some atoms emitting, so you will get a continuous signal.
 
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  • #4
hutchphd
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Summary:: Hydrogen emits electromagnetic radiation at 1420 MHz.

Does one typically learn that all atoms emit electromagnetic radiation all time in Inorganic Chemistry Class, Organic Chemistry class, or in physics class?

For people who learned in school or college that all or virtually all hydrogen atoms and other atoms emit electromagnetic radiation all the time, in what class did you learn this?

Incorrect Science 101

.
 
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  • #5
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So you are saying in all your courses you were never introduced to Bohr atom model and Rydberg formula? Things like hydrogen spectral series?

I definitely learned about the structure of an atom. For instance, i remember learning that there can be a maximum of 2 electrons in the first "ring" or energy level (or maybe orbital is the word) around the nucleus and a maximum of 8 electrons in the second energy level around the nucleus. I don't know if that is precisely what you are talking about with the Bohr model. The words Rydberg Formula don't sound familiar to me. I took these classes twenty plus years ago, so it is hard to remember.

I dont know exactly what you mean by hydrogen spectra series.
 
  • #6
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It is not true that all atoms emit EM radiation all the time. Most atoms don't emit radiation most of the time. But if you have a large enough mass of gas, there will always be some atoms emitting, so you will get a continuous signal.

Thanks for clarifying. That is most definitely helpful, but it does not address the OP.
 
  • #7
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Nobody directly addressed the OP, although borek's post implied that one learns this stuff in some sort of chemistry class.
 
  • #8
Vanadium 50
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Nobody directly addressed the OP

@hutchphd did in post #4. I can understand you not liking the answer, but that's the answer. Your premise is "where should I learn wrong things"?
 
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@hutchphd did in post #4. I can understand you not liking the answer, but that's the answer. Your premise is "where should I learn wrong things"?

In what class would one learn what mjc123 wrote in post #3?
 
  • #10
russ_watters
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In what class would one learn what mjc123 wrote in post #3?
My recollection is I learned about emission/absorption spectra in a low level college physics course (probably Physics II for non physics majors).
 
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  • #11
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My recollection is I learned about emission/absorption spectra in a low level college physics course (probably Physics II for non physics majors).
Well, no wonder i did not learn it in college then. I never attended a physics class in college.
 
  • #12
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Summary:: Hydrogen emits electromagnetic radiation at 1420 MHz.

Does one typically learn that all atoms emit electromagnetic radiation all time in Inorganic Chemistry Class, Organic Chemistry class, or in physics class?
This is not true, which is why it is not taught. Also, it has limited relevance.
I learned that hydrogen atoms emit electromagnetic radiation from reading Paul Davies book The Eerie Silence. I did not learn that all hydrogen atoms or virtually all hydrogen atoms emit electromagnetic radiation from any of the chemistry or physics classes that I took in high school or college. I read The Eerie Silence years after I had completed school.

My understanding is that all or virtually all hydrogen atoms emit electromagnetic radiation all the time at the frequency of 1420 MHz. I believe that all atoms or virtually all atoms of all elements emit electromagnetic radiation all the time.
You are wrong in that belief.
All hydrogen isotopes do have hyperfine structure, but because they have different nuclear magnetic momenta, they radiate at different frequencies. Notably tritium has same spin as protium, but different magnetic momentum and therefore different radiation frequency.
Atoms with zero electron spin in ground state have no hyperfine splitting. Atoms with zero nuclear spin have none either.

You migt learn about hyperfine structure in NMR and ESR, if you are taught advanced theory. Or you might just be taught the applications, how to interpret NMR spectra.
 
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  • #13
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This is not true, which is why it is not taught. Also, it has limited relevance.

You are wrong in that belief.
All hydrogen isotopes do have hyperfine structure, but because they have different nuclear magnetic momenta, they radiate at different frequencies. Notably tritium has same spin as protium, but different magnetic momentum and therefore different radiation frequency.
Atoms with zero electron spin in ground state have no hyperfine splitting. Atoms with zero nuclear spin have none either.

You migt learn about hyperfine structure in NMR and ESR, if you are taught advanced theory. Or you might just be taught the applications, how to interpret NMR spectra.

That all went over my head. My understanding of chemistry is limited.


What is NMR and ESR?

What is protium?
What is tritium?
 
  • #14
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What is NMR and ESR?

What is protium?
What is tritium?
Protium and tritium are different isotopes of hydrogen. Protium is hydrogen-1 (most common, over 99,98 % on Earth, even more in space), tritium is hydrogen-3 (radioactive).

NMR and ESR are analysis methods: Nuclear Magnetic Resonance and Electron Spin Resonance.
 
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  • #15
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What is NMR and ESR?
NMR - nuclear magnetic resonance, which is the basis for MRI scans (magnetic resonance imaging).
ESR -- I don't know off the top of my head. If I were curious, I would google it to see if this acronym is expanded somewhere - hint.
What is protium?
What is tritium?
I hadn't heard the term "protium" before, but I would bet that it's the isotype of hydrogen with a single proton. The other two isotopes of hydrogen have either one proton and one neutron (deuterium) or one proton and two neutrons (tritium).
 
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  • #16
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BTW, several off-topic posts about grammar have now been deleted. Let's stay on track here with the topic at hand.
 
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  • #17
hutchphd
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I hadn't heard the term "protium" before, but I would bet that it's the isotype of hydrogen with one neutron. The other two isotopes of hydrogen have two protons (deuterium) or three protons (tritium). All of these isotopes have one proton.
I'm with you about "protium"....never seen it before. You miss-counted your neutrons however on the others however.
 
  • #18
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The heart of this thread is the question i asked in post #9. Only russ_waters has answered that question.
 
  • #19
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You miss-counted your neutrons however on the others however.
I noticed that, and fixed the counts right around the time you posted. They're correct in my edited post.
 
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  • #20
hutchphd
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The heart of this thread is the question i asked in post #9. Only russ_waters has answered that question.

Then may I recommend we close it.
 
  • #21
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Then may I recommend we close it.
The remedy is for everyone to answer the OP, not to close the thread. Closing the thread won't answer the OP.
 
  • #22
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Done...
 
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