News Iraqi unrest, Syrian unrest, and ISIS/ISIL/Daesh

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The Iraqi government is facing imminent collapse under insurgent pressure, with ISIS reportedly taking control of Mosul. The U.S. has refused military aid to Iraq, primarily to avoid appearing to support Prime Minister al-Maliki, whose Shiite leadership could be seen as backing Iran. Concerns are rising that if insurgents gain control of Baghdad, it could lead to increased conflict with Iran. The Iraqi army, despite being well-trained and outnumbering ISIS, has shown reluctance to engage, leaving military equipment behind in their retreat. The situation is evolving into a civil war, raising fears of broader regional instability and the potential resurgence of terrorism globally.
  • #601
From Greg's link

"But in fact, what the foreign fighters are finding in Syria and Iraq is that they're more likely to get killed in Iraq and Syria, and in fact, instead of getting a slave bride as ISIS leaders promise them, they're more likely to get killed by a female Peshmerga fighter in the streets of Kobani."

akin to natural selection.

Orwell was bright enough to figure out he'd joined the wrong cause, and was lucky enough to survive. (Homage to Catalonia)
 
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  • #603
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  • #604
IS jihadists take Ramadi but pinned back in Palmyra
http://news.yahoo.com/dozens-dead-fighting-ancient-syrian-city-palmyra-082617643.html

Baghdad (AFP) - The Islamic State group sealed its capture of Ramadi Sunday after a dramatic pullout by Iraqi forces but was prevented by Syrian troops from taking the heritage site of Palmyra.

Iraqi Prime Minister Haider al-Abadi urged government forces to hold fast in Ramadi and prevent IS from making further gains, saying they would have air cover and Shiite militia reinforcements.

The effective loss of the capital of Iraq's largest province of Anbar marked one of Baghdad's worst setbacks since it began a nationwide offensive last year to reclaim territory lost to the jihadists in June 2014.
. . . .
 
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  • #605
Ramadi has a population of near 200,000 and from reports was taken by 400 ISIS soliders. How horrifically badly out gunned were the defenders. That is astonishing that they could take the city. Why weren't bombs being dropped on their advancement to the city? 400 soliders!
 
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  • #606
oh ...
 
  • #607
Greg Bernhardt said:
Ramadi has a population of near 200,000 and from reports was taken by 400 ISIS soliders. How horrifically badly out gunned were the defenders. That is astonishing that they could take the city. Why weren't bombs being dropped on their advancement to the city? 400 soliders!
Bombs would have been dropped, but were stymied by a dust storm obscuring the view. That's when ISIS attacked, the Iraqi soldiers ran, and ISIS scooped up their tanks, APCs, and artillery. No worries, tho, it's merely a "setback", according to the administration. :rolleyes:
 
  • #608
Astronuc said:
IS jihadists take Ramadi but pinned back in Palmyra

Apparently, Isis has just captured Palmyra
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-32820857

BBC said:
The western coalition's bombing campaign has clearly hurt IS where it could. But it could never compensate for ground forces which are not competent, equipped or motivated enough to stand firm and hit back.

Only the Kurds in the north of both countries (most recently in north-eastern Syria) have proven able to do that.
 
  • #609
HossamCFD said:
Palmyra
A real shame. I saw visited 6 years ago and it was a real wonder.
 
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  • #610
It looks like most of the antiquities in Palmyra museum have already been transferred to Damascus prior to its capture by ISIS
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-32859347

From what I've known previously, radical Islam has a problem with statues that resemble animal and human form as well as anything that used to be worshipped as an idol. I don't think ISIS would go out of the way to destroy roman pillars and building ruins. I could be wrong though.
 
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  • #611
IS militants purge Syrian town of Assad loyalists
http://news.yahoo.com/group-seizes-town-iraqs-anbar-province-082610804.html

There is a great concern that Daesh will form a contiguous state in lands take in Syria and Iraq.

Meanwhile - Shi'ite militias advance on Islamic State insurgents near Iraq's Ramadi
http://news.yahoo.com/shiite-militia-deploy-near-iraqs-ramadi-081747740.html

For many Sunnis, the Shi'ite militias are as much of a concern as Daesh.
 
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  • #612
Defense chief: After Ramadi, Iraq's 'will to fight' at issue
http://news.yahoo.com/us-iraqs-fight-issue-takeover-ramadi-131535725.html

Although Iraqi soldiers "vastly outnumbered" their opposition in the capital of Anbar province, they quickly withdrew last Sunday without putting up much resistance from the city in Iraq's Sunni heartland, Carter said on CNN's "State of the Union."

The Iraqis left behind large numbers of U.S.-supplied vehicles, including several tanks, now presumed to be in Islamic State hands.

"What apparently happened is the Iraqi forces just showed no will to fight," Carter said. "They were not outnumbered; in fact, they vastly outnumbered the opposing force. That says to me, and I think to most of us, that we have an issue with the will of the Iraqis to fight ISIL and defend themselves."
. . . .
Iraqi lawmaker Hakim al-Zamili, the head of the parliamentary defense and security committee, called Carter's comments "unrealistic and baseless," in an interview with The Associated Press.

"The Iraqi army and police did have the will to fight IS group in Ramadi, but these forces lack good equipment, weapons and aerial support," he said.
. . . .
If the US provided weapons, including tanks, then al-Zamili's claims do not seem credible.
 
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  • #613
http://www.airforcetimes.com/story/.../air-force-isis-social-media-target/28473723/
"The [airmen are] combing through social media and they see some moron standing at this command," Carlisle said at the speech, which was sponsored by the Air Force Association. "And in some social media, open forum, bragging about command and control capabilities for Da'esh, ISIL, And these guys go 'ah, we got an in.'

"So they do some work, long story short, about 22 hours later through that very building, three JDAMS take that entire building out. Through social media. It was a post on social media. Bombs on target in 22 hours.
 
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  • #614
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  • #616
russ_watters said:
While that's neat and sort of funny in a twisted sort of way, I'm not happy that it was announced/publicized. All that accomplishes is to tip off the enemy to a flaw in their behavior that they will now, no doubt, correct.

You can bet his comments were vetted by people who know what's important NOT to say. The behavior they are hoping to stop is recruiting with these social media contacts. The 'sources and methods' of social media, 'moron' and death was intentionally used.

Don't ever think these kind of 'off the cuff' comments are actually that.
 
  • #617
I don't know - here is a time where political objectives don't align with military objectives. (And this is not necessarily a bad thing - nuclear weapons use in the Korean war would have certainly advanced the UNC's military objectives, but would have been a political disaster) The Administration has an interest in painting ISIS(L) as incompetent - I believe the phrase used was "junior varsity". This release does exactly that.
 
  • #618
Nothing was released that was of military importance. The actual 'sources and methods' to justify dropping three JDAMS on some building wasn't some fools selfie in front of a ISIS command building. :DD
 
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  • #619
nsaspook said:
Nothing was released that was of military importance. The actual 'sources and methods' to justify dropping three JDAMS on some building wasn't some fools selfie in front of a ISIS command building. :DD
I didn't see specifics, but my presumption was that it actually was the selfish itself that provided the GPS coordinates via geotagging. I have difficulty imagining another way it could have been attacked so quickly. I believe the Russian soldier's selfie in the Ukraine was similarly tagged with an exact location.

But V50 may be right that the truly remarkable stupidity of such may be unique enough that the tactical loss may be worth the strategic gain. Yes, I hope someone did a calculus of that.
 
  • #620
russ_watters said:
I didn't see specifics, but my presumption was that it actually was the selfish itself that provided the GPS coordinates via geotagging. I have difficulty imagining another way it could have been attacked so quickly. I believe the Russian soldier's selfie in the Ukraine was similarly tagged with an exact location.

Usually it's the other way around, other 'technical means' know the location and then secondary open location information is used to strengthen the military justification if needed to the required confidence level for an attack. The open sourced information makes for a sexy story that the media loves and it's a plausible reason but most sites strip metadata/ EXIF data when images are resized for the web.
 
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  • #621
Another possibility is that the US is getting this information through some other channel, a channel they do not want exposed. So only targets that have been identified or plausibly identified through some other means are attacked. Historically, this was the case during WW2 with Allied decryption of Enigma codes. It may well be that "moron selfie targeting" is only such a secondary method.
 
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  • #623
Perhaps we are on the verge of the perfect solution, a final apocalyptic war between Shiite and Sunni, Iran and Saudi Arabia and all their clients across the Middle East? Perhaps we should congratulate the US for this genius-level strategy that pits our enemies against each other? Would Sun Tzu and Machiavelli approve from their graves? In the ideal case, perhaps it will be over in a few months and end all wars to come?:rolleyes:

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2015/06/10/269371/mideasts-worst-case-a-big-war.html
 
  • #624
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  • #625
Astronuc said:
Iraq militias say they don't need US help in Anbar operation
http://news.yahoo.com/iraq-militias-dont-us-help-anbar-operation-184932908.html

From the Yahoo link

In Anbar itself, red and green flags with the operation's slogan — "Labaik you Hussein," or "At your command, Hussein" — flap in the wind and dust alongside posters hailing the Popular Mobilization Forces...

On the cars of the convoy young Ali Ahsan rode in, posters of Iran's Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei and Iraq's top Shiite cleric Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani decorated the windows and doors.

This doesn't sound good at all. Entering Ramadi or Fallujah with these banners spells disaster for the future of Iraq.

The slogan was dubbed "unhelpful" by the Pentagon last month, but the Popular Mobilization Forces dismissed any notions of sectarianism, saying the Imam Hussein is revered by all Muslims.

True, Hussein is revered by all muslims, but he's only an "Imam" to shiites. Sunnis almost never use the term "Labaik" with anyone but God. The slogan is seen as a form of idolatry by most Sunnis.
 
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  • #626
  • #627
Syrian Kurds advance into Daesh territory, getting closer to their de facto capital Raqqah.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-33132809

Turkey doesn't seem stoked about it.
However, Turkey's President Recep Tayyip Erdogan said he was troubled by the Kurdish advance, claiming it might "lead to the creation of a structure that threatens our borders".
 
  • #631
Daesh threat grows as 'caliphate' enters second year
http://news.yahoo.com/threat-grows-caliphate-enters-second-100440600.html

Beirut (AFP) - The Islamic State group's "caliphate" enters its second year Monday with the jihadists expanding their territory in Syria and Iraq, and their global reach, by claiming attacks in Tunisia and Kuwait.

The extremist group headed by Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi announced on June 29, 2014 that it was reviving a form of Islamic government known as the "caliphate", pledging it would "remain and expand".

In the year since, the group has gained more territory in Syria and Iraq despite an attempted [counterattack] supported by a US-led coalition air campaign.

It has also attracted a string of affiliates -- in Egypt, Libya, Yemen, Pakistan and elsewhere -- and sought to project fear on an international scale.
. . . .
 
  • #632
Sinai Province, Daesh affiliate in Egypt, are stepping up terrorists attacks in Egypt. On Monday, a bomb explosion killed the state prosecutor in Cairo. The following day another car bomb exploded near a police station in Cairo killing three people.

El Sisi's response was to vow legal reforms so that death sentences can be enforced more swiftly.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-33335504

Today a major terrorist attack occurred in Sinai. Terrorists attacked five checkpoints near Sheikh Zewaid town in northern Sinai simultaneously with mortars, RPGs, and suicide car bombs. This is unprecedented. It looks like they are trying to capture the town as opposed to their usual hit and run. The attack has been going on for hours and they're currently besieging the main police station in the town .

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-33340458

Security and army officials told the Associated Press that at least 50 troops had been killed and 55 wounded, and that several had also been taken captive.

Most of those who were killed are just conscripts who only wanted to finish their compulsory service time and go back to their lives. I had a lot of friends who spent their army service time in Sinai, though it was calmer back then. I was lucky enough that the random number generator didn't pick my birth date, so I was exempt from military service.
 
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  • #633
The 20-minute video published on Jaysh al-Islam's website on Tuesday mimics those produced by IS to announce the killing of government soldiers and Western hostages.

It includes similarly sectarian language, with IS members accused of betraying their fellow Sunni Muslims and allying themselves with "enemy Shia" and "Nusayris", a derogatory term for the heterodox Alawite sect to which President Bashar al-Assad belongs.

But in a clear subversion, the alleged IS fighters dressed in black robes with black balaclavas are shown being marched in chains through the Syrian countryside by armed men wearing the orange clothes which IS captives have been forced to wear before their deaths.

The last part of the video shows the 18 men in black kneeling before their Jaysh al-Islam captors, who remove their balaclavas before shooting them in the head with rifles.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-33342943

Hope that those executed ISIS members appreciated such flexible interpretation of their tradition... ;)
 
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  • #635
5 June 2015
ISIS video shows execution of 25 men in ruins of Syria amphitheater. Recently, ISIS has also made massive advancements in Middle East and Southern Asia. Reports declare the ISIS groups have reached in Pakistan and trying to infiltrate in China and India. The terror group has also reinforced itself by capturing advanced weaponry and procured missiles by different clients.
On the other hands, governments around the world are relying only on US to annihilate the group. Under this case, ISIS future seems to have no near end..
 
  • #636
Daesh has affiliates or sympathetic groups outside of Iraq-Syria

Afghanistan says US strikes destroy its Islamic State branch
http://news.yahoo.com/activists-28-killed-syrian-army-strikes-held-town-102327318.html

Too many disaffected or nihilistic individuals with weapons.
 
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  • #637
Astronuc said:
Too many disaffected or nihilistic individuals with weapons.

True enough yet that summary still smacks of "JV team", something to be dealt with by the county sheriff and social services. I suspect similar summaries were made about the Bolsheviks and Chinese Maoists in the 30s.
 
  • #638
Tony Stark said:
5 June 2015
ISIS video shows execution of 25 men in ruins of Syria amphitheater. Recently, ISIS has also made massive advancements in Middle East and Southern Asia. Reports declare the ISIS groups have reached in Pakistan and trying to infiltrate in China and India. The terror group has also reinforced itself by capturing advanced weaponry and procured missiles by different clients.
On the other hands, governments around the world are relying only on US to annihilate the group. Under this case, ISIS future seems to have no near end..


I think that ex. Iranians would disagree with you about only US being determined to anihilate ISIS.

(yes, ISIS has got high skill in making enemies all over the world)
 
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  • #639
One more reason to bring an end to Daesh - http://news.yahoo.com/training-camp-children-told-behead-doll-020639195.html#
 
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  • #640
The relevant question is not whether or not to end Daesh, but how.
 
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  • #641
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  • #642
http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-...to-allow-its-soil-for-airstrikes-against-isis
Turkey Agrees To Allow Use Of Its Soil For Airstrikes Against Daesh

This after a Daesh suicide bomber attacked in Suruc Turkey
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/cb58f4e4-3059-11e5-91ac-a5e17d9b4cff.html

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...ack-on-turkish-border-town-live-10401885.htmlAnd it appears Turkey is stepping into the fray
Turkish jets strike several Islamic State targets in Syria
http://news.yahoo.com/turkey-says-jets-strike-targets-syria-050147139.html
 
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  • #643
http://news.yahoo.com/us-turkey-seek-establish-islamic-state-free-zone-101202680--politics.html#

I think it needs to be much, much larger!
 
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  • #645
Astronuc said:
http://news.yahoo.com/us-turkey-seek-establish-islamic-state-free-zone-101202680--politics.html#

I think it needs to be much, much larger!
The relevant question is what action should be sanctioned to make it happen. A serious US air campaign? US ground troops?
 
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  • #646
Astronuc said:
And it appears Turkey is stepping into the fray
“This isn’t an overhaul of their thinking," a Western official in Ankara told the Guardian. "It’s more a reaction to what they’ve been confronted with by the Americans and others. There is at least a recognition now that ISIS isn’t leverage against Assad. They have to be dealt with.”
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/links-between-turkey-isis-now-195700510.html
 
  • #647
One question to think about - at this moment does Turkey or Iran more behave like US ally?
 
  • #648
Czcibor said:
One question to think about - at this moment does Turkey or Iran more behave like US ally?
True. At this very moment US and Iranian interests in Syria and Iraq coincide. However this will only last as long as ISIS does. With ISIS outside of the picture the US and Iran will be at odds again. The US is interested in an Iraq inclusive of its Sunni populace and an Assad-free Syria, both are not in the interest of Iran.

Turkey's behaviour is indeed very frustrating though. Their initial reluctance to make any effort to combat ISIS and when they're finally forced to do something about it they use the opportunity to fight the kurds; the group that's arguably most successful at combating ISIS.
 
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  • #649
mheslep said:
The relevant question is what action should be sanctioned to make it happen. A serious US air campaign? US ground troops?
While airstrikes have no doubt been working, without a strong ground presence I'm not sure how effective we'll be at moving into some of ISIS's more entrenched positions. The fact that ISIS has melded with civilian populations in Aleppo and other major cities and towns limits support from the air and makes delivering on-target precision munitions much more difficult.

My main concern is whether we are training enough moderate rebels to be effective. I prefer the "train and equip" method to sending in our own ground forces, but we need enough dependable partners on the ground lest we risk spinning our wheels. If other members of the coalition would commit to the training and ground support of the rebels, I believe it would not only boost military effectiveness of the rebels, but also their morale.
 
  • #650
HossamCFD said:
True. At this very moment US and Iranian interests in Syria and Iraq coincide. However this will only last as long as ISIS does. With ISIS outside of the picture the US and Iran will be at odds again. The US is interested in an Iraq inclusive of its Sunni populace and an Assad-free Syria, both are not in the interest of Iran.

Turkey's behaviour is indeed very frustrating though. Their initial reluctance to make any effort to combat ISIS and when they're finally forced to do something about it they use the opportunity to fight the kurds; the group that's arguably most successful at combating ISIS.
I wonder whether the US still consider in A.D. 2015 replacing Assad by someone nicer and keeping Iraq as one state as realistic goals.
 

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