News Iraqi unrest, Syrian unrest, and ISIS/ISIL/Daesh

[nsaspook]

Video: Islamic State group beheads US aid worker
http://news.yahoo.com/graphic-video-claims-us-aid-worker-beheaded-092630290.html

I guess this just confirms that ISIS is about brutal murder at the level of drug cartels. At least the drug cartels don't hide behind the facade of religion when they behead people.

 

[HossamCFD]

I guess this just confirms that ISIS is about brutal murder at the level of drug cartels. At least the drug cartels don't hide behind the facade of religion when they behead people.

This is sick beyond comprehension.

I can't imagine that the decision to behead a muslim convert was a popular one among ISIS ranks. Could it be a sign they're running out of hostages?

 

[mheslep]

I guess this just confirms that ISIS is about brutal murder at the level of drug cartels. At least the drug cartels don't hide behind the facade of religion when they behead people.

I think a drug cartel analogy, i.e. money and business, is a mistake. There's no multi millionaire Pablo Escobar type characters running IS. A cult is a good fit, with a Jim Jones at the helm that worships death, wants everyone and everything to die in pursuit of ego.

 

[nsaspook]

I think a drug cartel analogy, i.e. money and business, is a mistake. There's no multi millionaire Pablo Escobar type characters running IS. A cult is a good fit, with a Jim Jones at the helm that worships death, wants everyone and everything to die in pursuit of ego.

The history of ISIS is the history of making a buck. Brutally wiping out locals for looting and pillaging with kidnapping and ransom in the name of some Islamic law to make money has been a trademark since the beginning. It is a cult, a criminal cult.
http://news.usni.org/2014/10/27/isis-funds-terror-black-market-antiquities-trade

 

[mheslep]

To run an army requires money, yes, but that is not what they are about. They don't recruit radicals from Europe on promises of villas, yachts and luxury cars.

 

[nsaspook]

To run an army requires money, yes, but that is not what they are about. They don't recruit radicals from Europe on promises of villas, yachts and luxury cars.

Radicals from Europe have their own rational but the upper operations structure of ISIS has all the underpinnings of a massive criminal conspiracy run by con-men using an imitation of religion for a little extra zest and zeal from the rubes.

 

[edward]

Radicals from Europe have their own rational but the upper operations structure of ISIS has all the underpinnings of a massive criminal conspiracy run by con-men using an imitation of religion for a little extra zest and zeal from the rubes.

ISIS has all of the underpinnings of a drug cartel plus a lot more. Below is a great article about ISIS and crime.

Editor's note: Over the last few weeks the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) has expanded from its stronghold in northern Syria across large swathes of western Iraq. The speed and scale of the advance has caught most observers by surprise, as have reports that put the jihadist group's wealth as high as $2 billion. But just where does ISIS get the mountains of money that make it such a potent force? Click on the flashing icons above to find out.

The article shows six different areas of income for ISIS including:

Drugs, kidnapping, money-laundering
ISIS also makes money through techniques more familiar to mafia organizations than jihadist revolutionaries.
Josh Rogin, senior correspondent at The Daily Beast, told CNN that the group excels at "terrorist fundraising activities (like) kidnapping, robbing and thieving. They're (also) involved in the drug trade. They have money laundering schemes."
In the past week, scores of Turkish and Indian citizens have been abducted as ISIS has swept across large areas of northwestern Iraq.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/06/22/world/meast/mme-isis-money/#index

 

[jollyunclejoe]

This is sick beyond comprehension.

I can't imagine that the decision to behead a Muslim convert was a popular one among ISIS ranks. Could it be a sign they're running out of hostages?

Well yes, they do only have one American prisoner left, but I would guess that the choice to kill the latest hostage was well favored among the Daesh ranks, considering that Kassig used to be an Army Ranger during the Iraq War. Additionally, we don't know the circumstances of his conversion, and we don't know which ideology he adopted (I bet not the principles of the Islamic State). To the op, I agree. This whole situation is very distressing. It's hard to remember a time when Iraq wasn't a mess . . .

 

[mheslep]

... It's hard to remember a time when Iraq wasn't a mess . . .

Depends on your definition of mess, but 2008 to 2012? A lot of violence, but stable elections, no civil war, and no invading army from Syria.

 

[jollyunclejoe]

Depends on your definition of mess, but 2008 to 2012? A lot of violence, but stable elections, no civil war, and no invading army from Syria.

Good point, by 'mess' I was mostly thinking of the violence.

 

[Astronuc]

Depends on your definition of mess, but 2008 to 2012? A lot of violence, but stable elections, no civil war, and no invading army from Syria.

Well - the civil war was probably turned down to a simmer or low boil.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_Civil_War - may refer to various recent or historical periods.

• Iraqi insurgency (Iraq War) (2003–2011)

• Civil war in Iraq (2006–07)

• Iraqi insurgency (post-U.S. withdrawal) (began 2011)

It appears that Obama inherited the mess that Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld created. And the rest is history as they say.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2013/mar/06/james-steele-america-iraq-video

 

[mheslep]

Well - the civil war was probably turned down to a simmer or low boil.

Civil war doesn't seem to fit the situation at that time. The government was in control of all parts of the country, and the Iraqi homicide rate (per wiki) was 8 per 100K in 2012, less than that of Russia, the Philippines, and Brazil.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

 

[Czcibor]

The funniest comment concerning Iraq that I've read was something like:

After overthrowing Sadam, we [the US] need install there someone who is:
- secular;
- able to keep Iraq in order;
- friendly to the USA.
In other words someone like Sadam from '80s.

Civil war doesn't seem to fit the situation at that time. The government was in control of all parts of the country, and the Iraqi homicide rate (per wiki) was 8 per 100K in 2012, less than that of Russia, the Philippines, and Brazil.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

The Iraq body count index would imply something like 15 per 100 thousand for 2012.
https://www.iraqbodycount.org/database/
(assuming that their data are credible)

Anyway, if one want to defend this invasion, then I see better argument - the invasion was done well enough, according to the database mess started later, when after Americans dissolved the apparatus of repression and remnants of thuggish law and order finally collapsed.

Damn it, maybe you should have sent those troops instead of Iraq to Mexico? If anyway you would have to fight some irregular groups and spend lot's of money on nation building projects. Closer (so soldiers can go on weekend home), success more probable and chance for economy boost for nearby part of the USA. :D

 

[jollyunclejoe]

i

Well - the civil war was probably turned down to a simmer or low boil.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_Civil_War - may refer to various recent or historical periods.

• Iraqi insurgency (Iraq War) (2003–2011)

• Civil war in Iraq (2006–07)

• Iraqi insurgency (post-U.S. withdrawal) (began 2011)

It appears that Obama inherited the mess that Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld created. And the rest is history as they say.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2013/mar/06/james-steele-america-iraq-video

I believe that by that point the civil war wasn't a full blown civil war any more. I would call it an insurgency if it makes any difference at all. Czcibor, as I recall, Saddam wasn't too friendly with America or the West in general, although he did bring stability to his country (albeit through questionable methods). Also, we didn't necessarily invade Iraq to build the nation, we did it because the government was harboring terrorists.

 

[HossamCFD]

i

... we did it because the government was harboring terrorists.

What terrorists? Are you suggesting that Saddam had links to Al Qaeda or other islamist terrorist groups?

I thought the main reason for the invasion was the allegations of WMD.

 

[Czcibor]

i

I believe that by that point the civil war wasn't a full blown civil war any more. I would call it an insurgency if it makes any difference at all. Czcibor, as I recall, Saddam wasn't too friendly with America or the West in general, although he did bring stability to his country (albeit through questionable methods). Also, we didn't necessarily invade Iraq to build the nation, we did it because the government was harboring terrorists.

I think that waging a war against fiercely anti-American Iran counts as being more or less friendly. (sure, no body is perfect, but it seems a nice favour for the Washington)

 

[mheslep]

Anyway, if one want to defend this invasion,

Not particularly. I would like to describe Iraq as accurately as possible. To say things like another Saddam is needed is to do the opposite.

 

[jollyunclejoe]

What terrorists? Are you suggesting that Saddam had links to Al Qaeda or other islamist terrorist groups?

I thought the main reason for the invasion was the allegations of WMD.

Al-Qaeda. I wasn't trying to suggest that, I'm sorry, I was unclear. A better way to put it would have been to say that we invaded Iraq because the Bush administration merely believed that Saddam was harboring and supporting terrorists, and had been doing so since the early nineties. I still disagree on the WMDs being the principle reason, because I think that it was the supposed fact that Saddam plotted the 9/11 attacks w. Al-Qaeda that gave us reason to worry about the nukes. I think nukes by themselves wouldn't have resulted in our invading Iraq... I hope that's somewhat clearer. To Czibor, good point, I think I agree with you now. Yes, It certainly was a nice favour for Washington, and a nice one for Iraq as well. They got lots of military aid from us, unfortunately.

 

[HossamCFD]

Al-Qaeda. I wasn't trying to suggest that, I'm sorry, I was unclear. A better way to put it would have been to say that we invaded Iraq because the Bush administration merely believed that Saddam was harboring and supporting terrorists

Ah. Right. I see what you mean.

 

[Astronuc]

Hundreds honor Indiana aid worker slain in Syria
http://news.yahoo.com/set-honor-slain-indiana-aid-worker-133418466.html

 

[nsaspook]

As usual the targeting turned into a micro-managed mess.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/27/us/us-adds-air-power-but-isis-presents-elusive-target.html?_r=0

 

[Astronuc]

Mosul residents: IS group cuts phones in Iraq city
http://news.yahoo.com/mosul-residents-group-cuts-phones-iraq-city-135949543.html

BAGHDAD (AP) — Militants from the Islamic State group blocked all mobile phone networks in the largest Iraqi city they control, Mosul, accusing informants in the city of tipping off coalition forces to their whereabouts, residents told The Associated Press on Thursday.

Residents described a scene of "chaos" and "paralysis" in the city Thursday, a day after the militants announced their decision on their Mosul-based radio network. Businesses were at a standstill as residents tried to understand what was happening, they said. Some are still able to access the Internet, which operates under a different network. . . . .

 

[Astronuc]

Islamic State group attacks Kobani from Turkey!
http://news.yahoo.com/islamic-state-group-attacking-kobani-turkey-102358724.html

Turkey denies that Daesh is using its territory, which should be relatively easy to verify.

 

[Astronuc]

US says Iranian fighter jets bomb IS jihadists in Iraq
http://news.yahoo.com/iranian-jets-carried-anti-air-raids-iraq-us-232852689.html

Escalation? Awkward partnership?Meanwhile - INSIDE KOBANI: Kurdish women on the frontline
http://news.yahoo.com/inside-kobani-kurdish-women-frontline-105057293.html

 

[lisab]

US says Iranian fighter jets bomb IS jihadists in Iraq
http://news.yahoo.com/iranian-jets-carried-anti-air-raids-iraq-us-232852689.html

Escalation? Awkward partnership?

Strange bedfellows, indeed.

 

[Astronuc]

IS has executed 100 foreigners trying to quit: report
http://news.yahoo.com/executed-100-foreigners-trying-quit-report-140040461.html

London (AFP) - The Islamic State extremist group has executed 100 of its own foreign fighters who tried to flee their headquarters in the Syrian city of Raqqa, the Financial Times newspaper said Saturday.

An activist opposed to both IS and the regime of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad, who is well-known to the British business broadsheet, said he had "verified 100 executions" of foreign IS fighters trying to leave the jihadist group's de facto capital.

IS fighters in Raqqa said the group has created a military police to clamp down on foreign fighters who do not report for duty.

Some jihadists have become disillusioned with the realities of fighting in Syria, reports have said. According to the British press in October, five Britons, three French, two Germans and two Belgians wanted to return home after complaining that they ended up fighting against other rebel groups rather than Assad's regime. They were being held prisoner by IS.

Well, too bad they didn't figure this out before joining Daesh.

 

[Borg]

It's about time - General will use Daesh in future references.

The general leading the new U.S. military task force carrying out operations in Iraq and Syria said Thursday that in future he’ll be calling the Islamic State “Daesh” — a first in the Pentagon but one that brings him in line with much of the Arab world.

 

[Astronuc]

Daesh and other similar groups are a threat to the world and to Islam.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-30442506Meanwhile in Iraq - Kurds push to retake Sinjar from ISIS
http://www.npr.org/2014/12/20/372070534/kurdish-troops-free-yazidis-but-major-battles-remain
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way...ces-push-offensive-to-retake-sinjar-from-isis

 

[HossamCFD]

IS has executed 100 foreigners trying to quit: report
http://news.yahoo.com/executed-100-foreigners-trying-quit-report-140040461.html

I hope this sends a powerful message to anyone who was still considering sacrificing his future and go join them.

On a more fundamental level, I have a feeling that the whole ISIS thing might cause some disillusion about the caliphate idea in the minds of the general public in Muslim majority countries. I remember 10~15 years ago the concept of a caliphate was very often treated as a respected, albeit unattainable and a bit irrelevant, goal. Even though when people spoke of the caliphate they didn't usually have the stuff of ISIS in mind, some sort of Sharia law has always been at the heart of any discussion about the caliphate. Before ISIS the concept was pretty much untested, at least in the modern setup, and there was always room to argue for it at least theoretically. I feel like many people are now realising that this is just a bad idea.

 

[Astronuc]

Author's journey inside ISIS: They're 'more dangerous than people realize'
http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/22/world/meast/inside-isis-juergen-todenhoefer/index.html

"There is an awful sense of normalcy in Mosul," Todenhoefer said in an exclusive interview with CNN.
"130,000 Christians have been evicted from the city, the Shia have fled, many people have been murdered and yet the city is functioning and people actually like the stability that the Islamic State has brought them."

"

• One ISIS spokesman told Todenhofer: "slavery and beheadings [are] part of our religion"

• ISIS "preparing the largest religious cleansing campaign the world has ever seen," says Todenhoefer

"

 

[mheslep]

""I think the Islamic State is a lot more dangerous than Western leaders realize,""

Author's journey inside ISIS: They're 'more dangerous than people realize'
http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/22/world/meast/inside-isis-juergen-todenhoefer/index.html"

• One ISIS spokesman told Todenhofer: "slavery and beheadings [are] part of our religion"

• ISIS "preparing the largest religious cleansing campaign the world has ever seen," says Todenhoefer

"

""I think the Islamic State is a lot more dangerous than Western leaders realize,""

I'm not sure what the journalist thinks Westerner leaders "realize", or how Westerners underestimate, after mass beheadings posted continually on You Tube, enslavement, etc.

 

[Astronuc]

Islamic State executed nearly 2,000 people (mostly ) in six months: monitor
http://news.yahoo.com/islamic-state-executed-nearly-2-000-people-six-153157642.html

BEIRUT (Reuters) - The Islamic State militant group has killed 1,878 people in Syria during the past six months, the majority of them civilians, a British-based Syrian monitoring organization said on Sunday.

Islamic State also killed 120 of its own members, most of them foreign fighters trying to return home, in the last two months, according to the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights.

The militant group has taken vast parts of Iraq and Syria and declared a caliphate in territory under its control in June. Since then it has fought the Syrian and Iraqi governments, other insurgents and Kurdish forces.

Rami Abdulrahman, the head of the Syrian monitoring group, told Reuters that Islamic State killed 1,175 civilians, including eight women and four children.
He said 930 of the civilians were members of the Sheitaat, a Sunni Muslim tribe from eastern Syria which fought Islamic State for control of two oilfields in August.
. . .

There was recently an article that indicated services under Daesh are diminishing because folks who provide services are leaving their territory.

 

[Czcibor]

I hope this sends a powerful message to anyone who was still considering sacrificing his future and go join them.

On a more fundamental level, I have a feeling that the whole ISIS thing might cause some disillusion about the caliphate idea in the minds of the general public in Muslim majority countries. I remember 10~15 years ago the concept of a caliphate was very often treated as a respected, albeit unattainable and a bit irrelevant, goal. Even though when people spoke of the caliphate they didn't usually have the stuff of ISIS in mind, some sort of Sharia law has always been at the heart of any discussion about the caliphate. Before ISIS the concept was pretty much untested, at least in the modern setup, and there was always room to argue for it at least theoretically. I feel like many people are now realising that this is just a bad idea.

As warning: in the West there are still some people who would tell you that communism is a good idea, just the true one actually wasn't implemented.

 

[HossamCFD]

As warning: in the West there are still some people who would tell you that communism is a good idea, just the true one actually wasn't implemented.

I know and I think that will always remain the case. I think it's very difficult to completely defeat any ideology, however such an ideology becomes of little relevance when its proponents become the fringe. What matters to me is when the attitude of the average bloke towards the traditional caliphate idea changes from respect to almost ridicule.

 

[mheslep]

As warning: in the West there are still some people who would tell you that communism is a good idea, just the true one actually wasn't implemented.

I know and I think that will always remain the case. ..

Perhaps, though that should not be the case IMO, that is, it should be beyond the pale. There's no social pass for saying Hitler had it all right at a cocktail party, but Stalin or Mao? Its radical, but one can get a way with it.

 

[Czcibor]

Perhaps, though that should not be the case IMO, that is, it should be beyond the pale. There's no social pass for saying Hitler had it all right at a cocktail party, but Stalin or Mao? Its radical, but one can get a way with it.

Not on a party in my country. In 1939 we had a joint Hitler-Stalin invasion, so it would not work. (nowadays we joke that Ribbentrop-Molotov Pact is a rare case of an agreement in which Russians haven't betrayed their ally.) However, still we have some serious level of double standard concerning treatment of those both regime in case of prosecutions.

I'm curious however, how it is on parties in South America.

 

[mheslep]

Not on a party in my country. In 1939 we had a joint Hitler-Stalin invasion, so it would not work. ...

Yes, I should have excepted eastern Europe above. I traveled there years ago and made the mistake one day of wearing a shirt in public given to be me by a Russian athlete with Cyrillic writing on the back. The glares from every direction at me, and not my fiance, were unmistakable. Unfortunately, I'd guess that a large portion of the world's population outside Europe is oblivious that Stalin invaded Poland cooperatively with Hitler. Heck, there's no Hollywood film about the Stalin in Poland. Instead, we have this:

Mission to Moscow, 1943

...was made in response to a request by Franklin D. Roosevelt. ...

The film, made during World War II, shows the Soviet Union under Joseph Stalin in a positive light. Completed in late April 1943, the film is, in the words of Robert Buckner, the film's producer, "an expedient lie for political purposes, glossily covering up important facts with full or partial knowledge of their false presentation"

 

[Astronuc]

Foreigners fighting Islamic State in Syria: who and why?
http://news.yahoo.com/foreigners-fighting-islamic-state-syria-why-051028667--nfl.html

So far an estimated few dozen Westerners have joined Kurdish fighters battling Islamic State in northern Syria, including Americans, Canadians, Germans, and Britons.

The Syrian Kurdish armed faction known as the YPG has not released official numbers confirming foreign or "freedom fighters" and academics say it's hard to assess the total.

But the number pales compared to an estimated 16,000 fighters from about 90 countries to join Islamic State since 2012, according to the U.S. Department of State figures.

 

[Bystander]

"ISIS adopts two billion dollar budget for 2015" just now in my peripheral vision on the news ticker. Enough bean-counters and they'll be as paralyzed as the rest of the world.

 

[mheslep]

"ISIS adopts two billion dollar budget for 2015" just now in my peripheral vision on the news ticker. Enough bean-counters and they'll be as paralyzed as the rest of the world...

How could that be? The US (aka the sole superpower) President stated months ago, "Our objective is clear: We will degrade, and ultimately destroy, ISIL through a comprehensive and sustained counterterrorism strategy", and, "Last month, I ordered our military to take targeted action against ISIL to stop its advances. Since then, we’ve conducted more than 150 successful airstrikes in Iraq. These strikes have protected American personnel and facilities, killed ISIL fighters, destroyed weapons, and given space for Iraqi and Kurdish forces to reclaim key territory... "

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2014/09/10/statement-president-isil-1

 

[nikkkom]

As warning: in the West there are still some people who would tell you that communism is a good idea, just the true one actually wasn't implemented.

This is because people in the West see and feel on their skins _West's_ problems.

Some of the more educated people, who tend to think about global problems more than about "how can I buy a new iPhone" problems, conclude that these problems are not fixable, that West, democracy, capitalism are broken. That it needs to be destroyed, and a better system is needed.

Then they turn to various alternatives. Some think that communism of some form is the answer. Others become devout environmentalists. Etc.

I used to be angry about it, because all alternatives I know about so far look either non-realizable, socially unstable, or plainly even worse than the current Western system - and my anger was "how these guys can't see it? Are they intentionally blind to logic?". Specifically about Communism - we have ample evidence that it just does not work!

Then I realized that they do provide a useful service for us: by relentlessly criticizing current Western governments and societies, they from time to time in fact help to discover bad things in need of fixing. Realizing that they play this role helped me to not feel angry anymore.
(Yes, they also produce a lot of useless, conspiracy-theory style mad rants, such as "Moon landing was a fake!" or "Evil Monsanto GMO kills us!" - but I can live with just ignoring that).

 

[Astronuc]

Survivor recalls horror of Paris hostage drama
http://news.yahoo.com/paris-hostage-drama-bad-movie-202034654.html

Juergen Todenhoefer: "Terrible to feel that people can be enthusiastic about killing hundreds of millions of people"

"There is an enthusiasm that I've never seen before in warzones," he said.

"They are so confident, so sure of themselves. At the beginning of this year, few people knew of IS. But now they have conquered an area the size of the UK. This is a one per cent movement with the power of a nuclear bomb or a tsunami."

 

[Astronuc]

Jihadists groups, e.g., Daesh, wage high-tech war to win Western recruits
http://news.yahoo.com/jihadists-wage-high-tech-war-win-western-recruits-083333292.html

"Thirty years ago it took a long time to get everyone to Afghanistan" where jihadists were fighting Soviet troops, he said.

"Now they propagate through social media, that's why it can happen so quickly, they can rapidly ramp up recruitment."

Why we should be concerned.

Though jihadist propaganda is primarily intended to encourage Western recruits to join them in battle, it also urges sympathisers to carry out attacks at home.

 

[Astronuc]

Daesh is now exporting. Islamic State group reaches for Afghanistan and Pakistan
http://news.yahoo.com/islamic-state-group-reaches-afghanistan-pakistan-183209282.html

Disenchanted extremists from the Taliban and other organizations, impressed by the Islamic State group's territorial gains and slick online propaganda, have begun raising its black flag in extremist-dominated areas of both countries.

 

[Astronuc]

How long can Saudi Arabia stand on the sidelines?

http://www.newsweek.com/islamic-state-aims-occupy-mecca-300205

The recent early morning clash between a Saudi border patrol and extremists trying to enter Saudi Arabia from Iraq appears to be the latest indicator of the Islamic State’s (ISIS) intent to expand its influence and control from its stronghold in Syria and Iraq south into Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and the rest of the Arab Gulf where there is oil and what ISIS leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi and his followers would consider the ultimate prizes: the holy cities of Mecca and Medina.

 

[Astronuc]

Canadians come under fire from Daesh and engage them.

Canada special forces clash with IS in Iraq
http://news.yahoo.com/canada-special-forces-clash-iraq-195504092.html

Riyadh (AFP) - Saudi border guards have been given orders to shoot infiltrators on sight after three troopers were killed on the Iraqi frontier earlier this month, a spokesman said on Monday.

The orders apply to guards patrolling the southern border with Yemen as well as the northern frontier with Iraq, Major General Mohammed al-Ghamdi told AFP.

http://news.yahoo.com/saudi-border-guards-shoot-sight-orders-101257550.html

 

[Astronuc]

For Daesh, wheat season sows seeds of discontent
http://news.yahoo.com/special-report-islamic-state-wheat-season-sows-seeds-101623044.html

More than two dozen farmers told Reuters they had not planted the normal amount of seed, because they could not access their land, did not have the proper fertilizers or adequate fuel, or because they had no guarantees that Islamic State would buy their crop as Baghdad normally does.

Farmers, and Iraqi and United Nations' officials, now fear a drastically reduced crop this spring. That could leave hundreds of thousands of Iraqis hungry. But another big loser would be Islamic State, which controls territory that normally produces as much as 40 percent of Iraq's wheat crop.

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

How long can Saudi Arabia stand on the sidelines?

I can't wait till these guys run out of oil money
http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/21/middleeast/saudi-beheading-video/index.html

 

[Czcibor]

How long can Saudi Arabia stand on the sidelines?

http://www.newsweek.com/islamic-state-aims-occupy-mecca-300205

What do you mean by sideline? ;)
In military and intelligence cooperation they are clearly in alliance with the USA.
In case of ideology they are using locally and exporting Wahhabism, which is fuelling ISIS like movements.

The problem is that dropping that ideology would mean collapse of Saudi gov, so they don't have much choice so are heroically fighting problems that they create in the same time.

 

[Borg]

What do you mean by sideline? ;)
In military and intelligence cooperation they are clearly in alliance with the USA.
In case of ideology they are using locally and exporting Wahhabism, which is fuelling ISIS like movements.

The problem is that dropping that ideology would mean collapse of Saudi gov, so they don't have much choice so are heroically fighting problems that they create in the same time.

Makes me think of a fireman who also happens to be the village pyromaniac.