Is a 2 ply cylinder as strong as a 1 ply twice the thickness?

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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the structural integrity of a two-ply cylinder made from 2 mm steel sheets compared to a single 4 mm steel cylinder. It concludes that while the combined tensile strength of the two 2 mm sheets may be similar to that of a 4 mm cylinder, their resistance to buckling is significantly lower. The participants agree that spot welding is unnecessary and detrimental due to the introduction of local stresses. Additionally, they emphasize the importance of adhering to safety standards, such as the ASME Boiler and Pressure Vessel Code, when constructing pressure vessels.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of material properties, specifically steel and its behavior under tension and compression.
  • Knowledge of interference fits and their implications in mechanical assemblies.
  • Familiarity with buckling theory and its relevance to cylindrical structures.
  • Awareness of safety standards related to pressure vessels, such as the ASME Boiler and Pressure Vessel Code.
NEXT STEPS
  • Research the ASME Boiler and Pressure Vessel Code for compliance requirements in pressure vessel design.
  • Study the mechanics of buckling in cylindrical structures to understand failure modes.
  • Explore the properties and applications of adhesives and bonding techniques for metal assemblies.
  • Investigate the design and construction of vacuum-insulated pressure vessels for energy storage applications.
USEFUL FOR

Engineers, metal fabricators, and anyone involved in the design and construction of pressure vessels or cylindrical structures, particularly those considering energy storage solutions.

  • #31
jrmichler said:
what maximum pressure you are designing for,
Yes; the details are very important. Springs and gravity stores have been used for hundreds of years for a good reasons.

I can only think of one example of compressed gas energy storage and that's in air guns. Apparently, a 12g CO2 cartridge can deliver up to 200 shots (maximum permitted is 10J a shot so a couple of kJ stored - that's one Watt for half an hour, minus the efficiency losses). I brought that up as a ball park figure for what can be done. Of course, that ignores the actual energy involved in filling up the cartridge which would be very relevant in terms of 'energy storage'. Also one would have to consider the health and safety considerations involved in the factory producing them and the very high spec needed for the canisters. [Edit: about 60Bar]
 
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  • #32
sophiecentaur said:
I can only think of one example of compressed gas energy storage
I've been on dive boats that use a scuba tank to power the starter for their diesel engine, which seemed to work well. No dead battery issues. But it's telling that you only see this in a niche application where they had to have a bunch of high pressure cylinders onboard anyway.
 
  • #33
DaveE said:
But it's telling that you only see this in a niche application where they had to have a bunch of high pressure cylinders onboard anyway.
Many big diesel engines, in generators, HGV trucks, railway engines and ships, use compressed air to start.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air-start_system
 
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  • #34
DaveE said:
I've been on dive boats that use a scuba tank to power the starter for their diesel engine, which seemed to work well. No dead battery issues. But it's telling that you only see this in a niche application where they had to have a bunch of high pressure cylinders onboard anyway.
Now you’ve jogged my memory I remember starting aero engines with a blank cartridge.
Better than carrying a large battery. But I remember a light plane being forbidden to take off with its flat (lunch box size) battery. A jump start was’t allowed either.
No real excuse for a defunct dive boat battery though. Makes me wonder what else could have let them down in an emergency. But five bottles always(!) should have some air in them after a dive.
The numbers count in this project so other applications may not be relevant. Modelling does not always give valid conclusions in some engineering problems.
 

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