Is Spin an Intrinsic Property of Electrons?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the nature of electron spin and whether it is an intrinsic property of electrons, particularly in the context of its behavior in a Stern-Gerlach apparatus. Participants explore theoretical and practical aspects of measuring electron spin, as well as the implications of electron magnetic moments.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether an electron beam in a Stern-Gerlach apparatus splits into spin-up and spin-down components.
  • Another participant asserts that anything with a non-zero magnetic moment, including electrons, should separate into two beams in such an apparatus.
  • Some participants argue that while theoretically possible, practical challenges such as the dominance of the Lorentz force complicate the separation of electron beams in the Stern-Gerlach setup.
  • A participant suggests that the search for definitive proof of spin as an intrinsic property of electrons is misguided if it relies on experiments not suited for that measurement.
  • Concerns are raised about the ability of an electron at rest to possess angular momentum or a magnetic moment, questioning the nature of intrinsic properties.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the feasibility of measuring electron spin using the Stern-Gerlach apparatus, with some asserting theoretical possibilities and others emphasizing practical limitations. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the intrinsic nature of electron spin and its implications.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in the experimental setup for measuring electron spin, including the influence of external forces and the appropriateness of the chosen experiments for the questions posed.

bobie
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Just a simple question:
what happens to an electron beam in a S-G apparatus , does it split up in two spin-up/spin-down?
if not, can you tell why?

Thanks
 
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In theory, it could. In practice, however, the Lorentz force completely dominates as electrons are charged objects. Every tiny inhomogeneity in the setup (beyond the necessary one for the magnetic field), a tiny beam divergence and so on will ruin the separation. It is probably not impossible, but really hard, and I did not see it realized yet.
 
I just Googled "Stern-Gerlach with electrons" and got 148,000 results. It would be helpful if you were to take a look at a few of these and then ask questions about specific things you don't understand.
 
Simon Bridge said:
mfb said:
In theory, it could. In practice, however, the Lorentz force completely dominates as electrons are charged objects.

Simon's link says the same:
The problem with using a standard Stern-Gerlach magnet for electrons is that the splitting is completely blurred by the Lorentz force acting
on a beam of finite transverse dimensions [1]. Brillouin suggested an alternate experiment ... This approach, however, was declared unsound
I wonder why with Google I got only 4 hits , (most, German articles:https://www.google.it/search?num=10...1.1.0...0...1c.1.37.serp..0.1.171.PitejvVSe0c)
I was searching for a definitive proof that spin is an intrinsic property of the electron, present also when it is not orbiting in an atom, or even at rest.
Of course I do not understand many things , I have read a few threads here and I see I am not the only one.
I can't see, for example, how an electron at rest can have angular or particularly a magnetic moment, and how an intrinsic property can have two opposing values.
 
Last edited:
bobie said:
I was searching for a definitive proof that spin is an intrinsic property of the electron, present also when it is not orbiting in an atom, or even at rest.
This kind of bait and switch tactic in questioning is not appropriate. If that is what you want to know then ask directly about that. Do not ask about an experiment which is not suited to measuring the thing you are actually interested in. It wastes everyone's time, frustrates the participants, and gives a bad impression of you.

http://gabrielse.physics.harvard.edu/gabrielse/overviews/ElectronMagneticMoment/ElectronMagneticMoment.html
 
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