Laminar, transition, turbulent flow question

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the characteristics of fluid flow over a plate, specifically addressing whether a turbulent flow region must always be preceded by laminar and transitional regions. Participants explore the implications of Reynolds number and critical lengths in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that the presence of a turbulent flow region may depend on the flow velocity and the calculation of Reynolds number.
  • There is a proposition that regardless of flow velocity, there could always be a laminar region, even if it is infinitesimally small, leading to a discussion about critical lengths associated with Reynolds number.
  • One participant emphasizes the importance of dimensionless parameters in understanding flow characteristics and cautions against using extreme velocities, such as the speed of light, without proper context.
  • A later reply acknowledges the exaggerated example of using the speed of light but indicates that the concern arises from a specific textbook reference, suggesting a need for further clarification based on that material.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether a laminar region must always exist before turbulence, with some arguing for its necessity and others questioning this assumption based on flow conditions and Reynolds number calculations. The discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference the critical Reynolds number and its dependence on distance along the plate, but there are no definitive conclusions about the existence of laminar flow in all scenarios. The discussion includes assumptions about flow conditions and the applicability of results at various velocities.

pyroknife
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If we're considering fluid flow over a plate and found that at one location the flow is turbulent. Is it always the case that there is also a transition and laminar region before that turbulent region on the plate?
 
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That is going to depend on the flow velocity or however you are calculating Reynold's number for the plate.
 
SteamKing said:
That is going to depend on the flow velocity or however you are calculating Reynold's number for the plate.

Even if the flow velocity is gigantic, wouldn't there always be a laminar region, even if it is infinitesimally small?


Like for example let's say Velocity=speed of light.
Re=velocity*length/(kinematic viscosity)
Depending on what you classify the critical reynold's # as, you can always solve for a critical length (even if it's miniscule) and anything before that critical length is laminar flow.
 
pyroknife said:
Even if the flow velocity is gigantic, wouldn't there always be a laminar region, even if it is infinitesimally small?


Like for example let's say Velocity=speed of light.
Re=velocity*length/(kinematic viscosity)
Depending on what you classify the critical reynold's # as, you can always solve for a critical length (even if it's miniscule) and anything before that critical length is laminar flow.

If the reynolds number is defined in terms of distance along the plate, then there will always be a critical length at which the transition occurs. You are working in terms of dimensionless parameters, which is a good thing to do. Incidentally, please stay away from velocities approaching the speed of light until you have had some experience with special relativity. Your results will certainly always apply at values of the dimensionless group v/c much less than unity, which includes all the situations you are likely to ever run into in practice.
 
Chestermiller said:
If the reynolds number is defined in terms of distance along the plate, then there will always be a critical length at which the transition occurs. You are working in terms of dimensionless parameters, which is a good thing to do. Incidentally, please stay away from velocities approaching the speed of light until you have had some experience with special relativity. Your results will certainly always apply at values of the dimensionless group v/c much less than unity, which includes all the situations you are likely to ever run into in practice.
Thanks.

I was just using the speed of light as an exaggerated example.

I'm not sure if anyone's ever used Incropera's "Fundamentals of Heat and Mass Transfer Textbook." But this question was mainly due to the table at the end of chapter 7 in that book. If anyone's used it, I can explain further what caused my concern from that chapter,.
 

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