Limits of infinite sums of sequences

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the limits of infinite sums of sequences, specifically examining the conditions under which the limit of the sum of countably many sequences equals the sum of their individual limits. Participants explore the implications of the finite distributive property and question the validity of interchanging limits in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant asserts that the limit of the sum of two sequences equals the sum of their limits and questions if this holds for countably many sequences, seeking necessary and sufficient conditions for equality.
  • Another participant highlights that the problem involves two limits and emphasizes the challenge of interchanging limit operations without specific conditions.
  • A participant notes that necessary and sufficient conditions for the interchange of limits are difficult to establish, mentioning uniform convergence as a limited sufficient condition.
  • Counterexamples are provided, demonstrating that the limit of the sum can differ from the sum of the limits, specifically citing the series involving \(\frac{1}{2^n}\) as an illustration of this discrepancy.
  • Some participants express surprise that limits do not commute in this context, suggesting that uniform situations often facilitate commutation.
  • One participant revisits the counterexample, discussing the implications of treating \(0 \times \infty\) under certain conventions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the conditions under which the limit of the sum of sequences equals the sum of their limits. Multiple competing views and examples are presented, indicating ongoing debate and uncertainty.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on definitions of convergence and the unresolved nature of mathematical steps regarding the interchange of limits. The discussion highlights the complexity of the topic without providing definitive resolutions.

mag487
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I understand that the limit of the sum of two sequences equals the sum of the sequences' limis: [tex]\displaysyle \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty} (a_{n} + b_{n}) = \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty}a_{n} + \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty}b_{n}[/tex]. Similar results consequenly hold for sums of three sequences, four sequences, etc. (Call this the "finite distributive property.") But what about the sum of countably many sequences? Given the sequences [tex]\{a_{i} (n)\}[/tex], is it the case that

[tex]\displaystyle \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty} \sum_{i=1}^{\infty} a_{i}(n) = \sum_{i=1}^{\infty} \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty}a_{i}(n) ?[/tex]

If not, are there any extra conditions on the sequences sufficient to make the equality hold? Any necessary and sufficient ones? I have an argument that if if both sides of the equality are finite, then the it holds. However, I've very likely made a mistake and would appreciate it if you guys could/would point out any errors.

Let [tex]\displaystyle L := \Sigma_{i=1}^{\infty} \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty}a_{i}(n)[/tex]. So [tex]\displaysyle \forall \epsilon > 0 \exists S \forall s \geq S \ |L - \Sigma_{i=1}^{s}\lim_{n\rightarrow\infty}a_{i}(n)| < \frac{\epsilon}{2}.[/tex] Also let [tex]L_{n} := \Sigma_{i=1}^{\infty}a_{i}(n)[/tex]. We now therefore have, given the same [tex]\frac{\epsilon}{2}[/tex] as before, [tex]\forall T \exists t \geq T \ |L_{n} - \Sigma_{i=1}^{t} a_{i}(n) | < \frac{\epsilon}{2}[/tex]. Taking n to the limit on both sides yields [tex]\displaystyle \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty} |L_{n} - \Sigma_{i=1}^{t} a_{i}(n) | = |\lim_{n\rightarrow\infty}L_{n} - \Sigma_{i=1}^{t} \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty} a_{i}(n) | \leq \frac{\epsilon}{2}[/tex] (by the finite distributive property). Finally, define [tex]L_{0} := \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty}L_{n}, \ U := \max(S, T)[/tex]. Then for each [tex]u \geq U[/tex], we have both [tex]|L - \Sigma_{i=1}^{u} \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty} a_{i}(n) | < \frac{\epsilon}{2}[/tex] and [tex]|L_{0} - \Sigma_{i=1}^{u} \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty} a_{i}(n) | \leq \frac{\epsilon}{2}[/tex]. By the triangle inequality, then, [tex]|L - L_{0}| < \epsilon[/tex]. Since epsilon was arbitrary, [tex]L = L_{0}[/tex].

What about the cases where the sides aren't finite?
 
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I don't know the answer off the top of my head, but I do want to point this out.

What you have is essentially TWO limits. The infinite sum cannot be directly evaluated and so it is actually a limit in disguise. So your question boils down to when can you interchange two limit operations?

I'm not a good analysis student, though, and I don't know the exact conditions.
 
necessary and sufficient conditions are hard to come by
uniform convergence is a useful though limited sufficient condition
 
O.K., here's an easy counterexample to the general claim:

[tex]\displaystyle \sum_{i=1}^{\infty} \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty} \frac{1}{2^{n}} = 0, \ \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty} \sum_{i=1}^{\infty} \frac{1}{2^{n}} = \infty.[/tex]

Limits usually behave so naturally in terms of commuting with other operators that I'm still somewhat surprised they don't commute here.
 
Limits usually behave so naturally in terms of not commuting with other operators that I'm still somewhat unsurprised they don't commute here. Often uniform situations are used that gives commutation. It is easy to produce counter examples by using nonuniform limits.
 
Hey mag487,

Did you get to verify if your argument was correct? I went through your proof and couldn't find any loophole; however I am no expert in analysis.
 
mag487 said:
O.K., here's an easy counterexample to the general claim:

[tex]\displaystyle \sum_{i=1}^{\infty} \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty} \frac{1}{2^{n}} = 0, \ \lim_{n\rightarrow\infty} \sum_{i=1}^{\infty} \frac{1}{2^{n}} = \infty.[/tex]

Limits usually behave so naturally in terms of commuting with other operators that I'm still somewhat surprised they don't commute here.

Since the 1/2^n doesn't have an i in it you can take it out of the summation in both cases so you get 0*infinity in both cases. If you adopt a 0* infinity =0 convention then both sides are equal to zero.
 

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