Native Species from 2 Nonnatives?

[Cesium]

A few days ago, I watched The Wild Parrots of Telegraph Hill, a documentary about wild parrots in San Francisco. There are two different species of parrots that never come into contact with one another in the wild because they live in different parts of South America. However, these two nonnative species interbed in San Francisco, producing a hybrid species that is totally unique. My friend and I had an argument over whether this new parrot species is native or nonative to San Francisco. Is there an answer to this or is it just a matter of semantics?

 

[scott1]

The texas Long horn was a hybrid between spansih cattle and bufflo and thhere considerd a Native species.The new hybrid whould be a Native since there born and there not seen any where elese.

 

[Ouabache]

I have not seen this documentary, but believe they aired a short segment about it, on AnimalPlanet channel. I read a http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050331/REVIEWS/50322003/1023 and they describe the birds as conures. There are a large variety of http://www.concentric.net/~conure/conures.shtml , as you might expect, coming from several warmer climates.

Two different species cannot mate and produce viable offspring. That is one of the differences between species. Probably the two non-native birds mentioned were varieties of the same species. Two varieties can look quite different. Those can have healthy normal offspring.

You are right about semantics. I could contend these two varieties came from South America, transplanted to a new location, adapted themselves and reproduced within their own flocks. These birds are nonindigenous (nonnative). When two conures of different varieties come together and produce fertile offspring in this new environment, you could say this hybrid variety is indigenous, but the species itself is nonindigenous. So you are both partially right

 

[Ouabache]

Where did you hear that?

The texas Long horn was a hybrid between spansih cattle and bufflo and thhere considerd a Native species.The new hybrid whould be a Native since there born and there not seen any where elese.

I've read that Texas Longhorns developed from a number of different cattle breeds (Longhorn Herefords of England, early Durham cattle added the roan speckling, Spanish breeds contributed Earth tone colors and mongrel American cattle breeds) but no buffalo. http://www.texaslonghorn.com/longhorn_info/longhorn_history/origin.shtml

Buffalo and cattle do produce a hybrid called http://www.centralpets.com/animals/mammals/cattle/cow5133.html .
They are a cross between two distinct species and are a true hybrid. The American Beefalo hybrid is specifically 3/8 bison and 5/8 bovine and are fertile. They are a hardy animal but also domestic. Due to the hardiness of their buffalo ancestry, they probably could survive well on their own in short grass prairies but I don't know if they have attempted this experiment.

When I use the word indigenous, the meaning I am thinking is that they reproduce naturally and can survive on their own. I don't know if the later criterion has been tested on beefalo. The initial cross between parental stock is not natural. It requires human intervention. But succeeding generations do reproduce normally.