Osama Bin Laden killed by US in Pakistan

[qspeechc]

Regardless of whether Osama fought back or not, the more I think about it, the less likely it seems to me the USA would want to give him a trial.

Where would this trial be held? Probably the Hague. The case will likely take a very long time (lawyers are very skilled in stretching out court cases). Osama could easily die a natural death before the end of the case.

There would definitely be terrorist attacks against the Netherlands because of this case, can you imagine the security that would be needed? Literally an army would be needed, and for over many years. Would the Netherlands want to hold this case with the threat of terrorist attacks? Would any country in the world?
The lawyers on the prosecution would get death threats, who would want to take the case?

And then there is the possibility of Osama getting off on a technicality. While the case was going on Osama would be living a relatively comfortable life, rather more comfortable than hiding in a cave.

After several years in court and no result, the American people, and people around the world would become very angry indeed. And if Osama died a natural death while the case was on-going, or got off, or they could only pin him for a few things, can you image how angry people around the world would be?

In the end, it doesn't seem likely to me that the USA wanted to give him a fair trial. They probably wanted him to put up a fight so they could kill him.

 

[Borg]

It will be interesting to see what happens to Obama's poll numbers today.
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/obama_administration/daily_presidential_tracking_poll"

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

The same guy that forges fake passports also forges fake birth certificates. During a recent conversation with President Obama, he mentioned that it would be more difficult to trace his tracks if Bin Laden's death could be faked.

 

[tiny-tim]

And I'm not sure... what's the significance of the number 79?

It's the number of Star Trek episodes (and also the smallest number that can't be represented as a sum of fewer than 19 fourth powers).

But perhaps the most important thing about 79 is, according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/79_(number)" …

Seventy-nine is the natural number following 78 and preceding 80.^{[citation needed]}​

… citation needed! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

 

[russ_watters]

Wiki says that a "round number is mathematically defined as the product of a considerable number of comparatively small factors."

I get it. Sounds just like bin laden.

Sorry, I should have said even number. Two helicopters with a capacity of 40 passengers each and one had 39 people in it. That leaves an open seat on the flight out.

Regardless, after thinking about it more, I'm not sure it implies anything we don't already know, so not a big issue.

 

[Amp1]

Maybe that seat was for the dog?!?, I read this whole thread and noticed what appears to be quite a few kids here. As variably mature grownups, let's be careful to keep the guidelines in mind.

I think most people partisan or not are content with the news of Osamas' passing. Considering I still see sometimes the surrealism when I dream, I'm happy US got him. I hope however that our gov dosen't stop with him but goes after everyone or anyone that helped carry out the 9/11 attack.

 

[russ_watters]

Maybe that seat was for the dog?!?

Well the flight back was planned to carry 80 though that number is clearly not a hard limit. They had to carry the other helicopter crew too.

 

[OmCheeto]

...

Seventy-nine is the natural number following 78 and preceding 80.^{[citation needed]}​

… citation needed! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

I'll second that.

But did you see this: 79: The record cumulative weeks at #1 on the Billboard charts, held by Elvis Presley

I've heard from very reliable sources on Facebook that Osama was spotted with Elvis in Vegas just yesterday. Coincidence?

 

[tiny-tim]

Address unknown!

 

[Char. Limit]

It will be interesting to see what happens to Obama's poll numbers today.
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/obama_administration/daily_presidential_tracking_poll"

I note that this says that two thirds of the interviews were conducted BEFORE Osama's reporting of death. So I'll just wait for the next one. But that aside, I checked Bush's approval ratings in 2004, and I noticed that he won an election despite having a less than 50% approval rating. So I'm not even sure I can trust these polls in general.

Not to mention, the entire Republican party strongly disapproves of Obama.

 

[WhoWee]

I note that this says that two thirds of the interviews were conducted BEFORE Osama's reporting of death. So I'll just wait for the next one. But that aside, I checked Bush's approval ratings in 2004, and I noticed that he won an election despite having a less than 50% approval rating. So I'm not even sure I can trust these polls in general.

Not to mention, the entire Republican party strongly disapproves of Obama.

IMO - he did a good job on this. Likewise, I think most Republicans and Independents have acknowledged President Obama on his leadership in this event. He made a strong decision - to use the SEALs (rather than a large bomb) and not to involve the Pakistani forces. This surgical strike has enabled positive identification of the terrorist and resulted in the gathering of data. On the other hand, Republicans don't seem to appreciate comments that ground work/frame work put in place by Bush deserve no credit.

President Obama should experience a short term increase in polls. The long term results will depend upon his leadership in other areas.

 

[russ_watters]

Foxnews is reporting that three options were weighed:

1. The SEAL mission
2. A standard bombing mission
3. Unknown. Speculated to be a Predator attack.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/05/02/obama-plays-key-role-decision-process-bin-laden/

This is interesting because only the SEAL mission carries with it the possibility of bringing Bin Laden back - dead or alive. Some thoughts:

1. It says they were worried about #1 becasuse of the military and ex-military in the area possibly hearing/seeing the helicopters and alerting Bin Laden. That mission also carries the most risk for personnel.

2. It says Obama was worried about collateral damage for #2. I say: with such a high value target in such a large compound, screw collateral damage. The only people inside the compound would have close ties to Bin Laden anyway and there would be little risk of collateral damage outside the compound. Perhaps also, Pakistan might have objected more strongly to an American 2,000 lb bomb going of 30 miles from Islamabad, but screw them too.

3. Predator attack? Much too small to have a substantial chance of success. I was thinking about other possibilities and my guess would have been lone sniper. Odds of success are lower than for the others, but still pretty good.

 

[Char. Limit]

Foxnews is reporting that three options were weighed:

1. The SEAL mission
2. A standard bombing mission
3. Unknown. Speculated to ge a Predator attack.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/05/02/obama-plays-key-role-decision-process-bin-laden/

This is interesting because only the SEAL mission carries with it the possibility of bringing Bin Laden back - dead or alive. Some thoughts:

1. It says they were worried about #1 becasuse of the military and ex-military in the area possibly hearing/seeing the helicopters and alerting Bin Laden. That mission also carries the most risk for personnel.

2. It says Obama was worried about collateral damage for #2. I say: with such a high value target in such a large compound, screw collateral damage. The only people inside the compound would have close ties to Bin Laden anyway and there would be little risk of collateral damage outside the compound. Perhaps also, Pakistan might have objected more strongly to an American 2,000 lb bomb going of 30 miles from Islamabad, but screw them too.

3. Predator attack? Much too small to have a substantial chance of success. I was thinking about other possibilities and my guess would have been lone sniper. Odds of success are lower than for the others, but still pretty good.

Leave it to FOX to complain about how we got Bin Laden...

 

[Borg]

I note that this says that two thirds of the interviews were conducted BEFORE Osama's reporting of death. So I'll just wait for the next one. But that aside, I checked Bush's approval ratings in 2004, and I noticed that he won an election despite having a less than 50% approval rating. So I'm not even sure I can trust these polls in general.

Not to mention, the entire Republican party strongly disapproves of Obama.

I didn't read the part about the polls. Guess I'll have to wait til Thursday. I agree that polls often don't mean much. They are too often slanted to give the desired results IMO.

 

[russ_watters]

Leave it to FOX to complain about how we got Bin Laden...

I am not seeing a complaint anywhere in there. Could you quote the complaint please?

 

[CAC1001]

Foxnews is reporting that three options were weighed:

1. The SEAL mission
2. A standard bombing mission
3. Unknown. Speculated to ge a Predator attack.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/05/02/obama-plays-key-role-decision-process-bin-laden/

This is interesting because only the SEAL mission carries with it the possibility of bringing Bin Laden back - dead or alive. Some thoughts:

1. It says they were worried about #1 becasuse of the military and ex-military in the area possibly hearing/seeing the helicopters and alerting Bin Laden. That mission also carries the most risk for personnel.

On O'Reilly last night, Colonel Ralph Peters said that helicopters fly over that city all the time to the army base nearby, so to the people living in the compound, hearing helicopters approaching probably wouldn't have been anything out of the ordinary. The General who was also on, said that the mission would have been timed to coincide with when it is normal to hear helicopters flying over the area. He also said that those helicopters have a special muffler system that helps to make them more quiet than standard helicopters as well.

 

[Char. Limit]

Im not seeing a complaint anywhere in there. Could you quote the complaint please?

Never mind, I misread it. Too eager to cast a bad light on FOX, I guess.

 

[drankin]

Another problem with a bombing of the compound would be finding a body and identifying it via coordination with the local government. A very messy option. It was done the best way it could have been done IMO.

 

[turbo]

Another problem with a bombing of the compound would be finding a body and identifying it via coordination with the local government. A very messy option. It was done the best way it could have been done IMO.

Agreed. It also avoided collateral damage (needless death and destruction in the neighborhood), and allowed for the preservation and collection of additional evidence that might lead to the apprehension of more of OBL's close associates. Dropping a 2000# bomb on the compound would not have been too smart.

 

[jreelawg]

It was really stupid to dispose of the body the way they did. A lot of people are going to be skeptical it really happened. All we have left now to prove we got him, is the prospect of a photograph being released. And in my opinion they really ought to release the photography.

So far I have heard- That they wanted to dump the body in the Sea to give Osama a dignified muslim burial while preventing a shrine from forming. Are you serious?! And now they are hesitant to release pictures because, "it might put future or current operations at risk?

Hopefully they have better reasons than these IMO. I heard Anderson Cooper say these type of special forces operations are kept secretive often putting out cover stories, and only years later what really happened comes out.

Maybe they really roasted him with some kind of classified energy weapon or something.

Oh well hopefully they get out the pictures soon.

 

[Char. Limit]

I don't think it really matters if they release the photography. If they do, believers will continue to believe and disbelievers will say it's photoshopped or something.

 

[WhoWee]

IMO - Harry "the War is Lost" Reid has a lot of nerve to give a speech about this success.


http://www.cnn.com/video/?/video/politics/2011/05/02/bts.reid.senate.obl.remarks.cnn

 

[Newai]

IMO - Harry "the War is Lost" Reid has a lot of nerve to give a speech about this success.

Why? I had the same feelings, that almost a decade without OBL's head and no light at the end of the tunnel, that the fight against terror was going nowhere.

 

[WhoWee]

Why? I had the same feelings, that almost a decade without OBL's head and no light at the end of the tunnel, that the fight against terror was going nowhere.

Are you the leader of the US Senate - someone the troops deem important - someone the enemy might parrot to build resistance? If you were - would you have expressed your thoughts on the floor of the Senate? On the other hand, he recently inferred his wife might lose her healthcare benefits if Planned Parenthood lost funding.

 

[Pengwuino]

I don't think it really matters if they release the photography. If they do, believers will continue to believe and disbelievers will say it's photoshopped or something.

Bin Laden is hiding in a base on the Moon.

Which America has never been to.

It's run by JFK.

 

[JaredJames]

Bin Laden is hiding in a base on the Moon.

Which America has never been to.

It's run by JFK.

:rofl:

I just got a picture in my head of Michael Jackson 'doing the walk' with an AK47 on guard duty.

 

[Pengwuino]

:rofl:

I just got a picture in my head of Michael Jackson 'doing the walk' with an AK47 on guard duty.

I wouldn't want to be in your head :yuck:

 

[jreelawg]

Bin Laden is hiding in a base on the Moon.

Which America has never been to.

It's run by JFK.

Everybody knows that Elvis is in charge of the moon base. Get your facts strait.

 

[JaredJames]

I wouldn't want to be in your head :yuck:

I don't most of the time...

 

[jreelawg]

Bin Laden is hiding in a base on the Moon.

Which America has never been to.

It's run by JFK.

Everybody knows that Elvis is in charge of the moon base. Get your facts strait.

And we all know that Obama is the real Osama.

 

[AlephZero]

Dropping a 2000# bomb on the compound would not have been too smart.

But if they had missed the compound and wiped out the nearby military academy instead, they could always have claimed it was an attack by Al Quaeda.

My suspicion is that the US has been wasting its time chasing an irrelevance for the last few years. Why? Count the number of protest demonstrations sweeping across the Islamic world. There was a statement from Hamas ... and that's about it.

What does everybody apart from Hamas know, that the USA doesn't? Possibly, who is REALLY running Islamic terrorism right now?

 

[rootX]

But if they had missed the compound and wiped out the nearby military academy instead, they could always have claimed it was an attack by Al Quaeda.

Pakistan is quite weak nation. US carried out a ground operation in a sovereign country without informing it and best response Pakistan came up with was it is ashamed that it was unaware of Osama's location.

What does everybody apart from Hamas know, that the USA doesn't? Possibly, who is REALLY running Islamic terrorism right now?

There is no centralized agency behind the terrorism.

 

[jreelawg]

I have to say, I'm not very impressed in the quality of the operation. If they truly did meet no armed resistance, and Bin Laden was unarmed and in bed when they killed him, why didn't they get him alive? Surely he would be worth more alive than dead right. I wonder what instructions they received? Who's orders/instruction, or lack of, lead to such a mistake?

 

[DaveC426913]

If they truly did meet no armed resistance, and Bin Laden was unarmed and in bed when they killed him

Wait, did I miss this?

 

[edward]

I have to say, I'm not very impressed in the quality of the operation. If they truly did meet no armed resistance, and Bin Laden was unarmed and in bed when they killed him, why didn't they get him alive? Surely he would be worth more alive than dead right. I wonder what instructions they received? Who's orders/instruction, or lack of, lead to such a mistake?

Except for the loss of a helicopter the operation went off exactly as planned. The Navy Seals mission did not include negotiating a surrender.