Partial differential derivation

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the derivation of the partial derivative chain rule, with participants exploring the foundational concepts and their applications. The original poster expresses uncertainty about the problem's requirements and seeks clarification on how to approach the derivation.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the relationship between variables and their dependence on a common parameter, t. There is an attempt to express differentials in terms of derivatives with respect to t. Questions arise about the validity of these approaches and whether they are on the right track in deriving the chain rule from first principles.

Discussion Status

The conversation includes various attempts to clarify the problem and explore different methods of derivation. Some participants have expressed doubts about their approaches, while others seek confirmation on whether their reasoning aligns with the problem's requirements. There is no explicit consensus, but productive dialogue is ongoing.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention concerns about overthinking the problem and the potential need for a deeper understanding of the chain rule before applying it to partial derivatives. There is also a note about the clarity of expressions used in the discussion, particularly regarding the notation for differentials.

Taylor_1989
Messages
400
Reaction score
14

Homework Statement


Hi guys, I am having a problem, knowing where to start with this question. Before I spend trying derive the partial derivative chain rule from first principles I would just like to know if this is what this questions is asking. If it is not asking that, how do I go about solving it.
upload_2017-3-3_2-20-29.png

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


I have not shown solution beacuse I am unware where to start
 
Physics news on Phys.org
I have mange to come up with one solution, which: If I think that y,x are all functions of t. Then I could say: dx=dx/dt *dt and dy=dy/dt *dt sub into the total differential and get ##\partial{df}{dx}\frac{dx}{dt}*dt+\partial{df}{dy}\frac{dy}{dt}*dt## I am just unsure of this method, I feel like I am cheating, any advice?
 
Taylor_1989 said:
I have mange to come up with one solution, which: If I think that y,x are all functions of t. Then I could say: dx=dx/dt *dt and dy=dy/dt *dt sub into the total differential and get ##\partial{df}{dx}\frac{dx}{dt}*dt+\partial{df}{dy}\frac{dy}{dt}*dt## I am just unsure of this method, I feel like I am cheating, any advice?
This -- ##\partial{df}{dx}\frac{dx}{dt}*dt+\partial{df}{dy}\frac{dy}{dt}*dt## -- doesn't make any sense. The expression ##df## is defined (it's the differential of f), but this one ##\partial f## doesn't mean anything.

You have f(x, y) where x is a function of t and y is another function of t. This means that f is ultimately a function of t, albeit one with two parameters.
 
Sorry for the bad latex, I did eventually solve the problem. I was over thinking the problem and thought I had to derive partial chain rule from first principles, which I on my way to doing, by deriving the non partial chain rule. As a question, am I on the right lines if I derive chain rule from first principles then, then apply the same method to partial, would I be able to derive the above formula?
 
Taylor_1989 said:
Sorry for the bad latex, I did eventually solve the problem. I was over thinking the problem and thought I had to derive partial chain rule from first principles, which I on my way to doing, by deriving the non partial chain rule. As a question, am I on the right lines if I derive chain rule from first principles then, then apply the same method to partial, would I be able to derive the above formula?
Which formula above do you mean?
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
Replies
2
Views
2K
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K