News Pat Robertson and the power of free speech

[Kerrie]

http://www.comcast.net/news/national/index.jsp?cat=DOMESTIC&fn=/2005/11/11/261991.html"

Once again, we have Pat Roberston in the news claiming doom and gloom to any of those who go against religious teachings. But hey, it IS America where you can express what you want. Good thing our media is there to catch what he has to say. Do you think he is the only one who doesn't realize how crazy he sounds?

 

[Skyhunter]

http://www.comcast.net/news/national/index.jsp?cat=DOMESTIC&fn=/2005/11/11/261991.html"
Once again, we have Pat Roberston in the news claiming doom and gloom to any of those who go against religious teachings. But hey, it IS America where you can express what you want. Good thing our media is there to catch what he has to say. Do you think he is the only one who doesn't realize how crazy he sounds?

Unfortunately he is not the only one.

I wonder how many residents of that school district will move since they are no longer under God's protection

 

[Evo]

I wonder how many residents of that school district will move since they are no longer under God's protection

If they all move away, I'm moving there.

 

[Astronuc]

Once again, we have Pat Roberston in the news claiming doom and gloom to any of those who go against religious teachings. But hey, it IS America where you can express what you want. Good thing our media is there to catch what he has to say. Do you think he is the only one who doesn't realize how crazy he sounds?

Sadly too many people by into that ********.

Roberston is to religion, as Bush is to government.

 

[Pengwuino]

Oddly enough, I finally found out what the 700 club was after reading that article last night.

I thought it was some sort of congressional show.

 

[Skyhunter]

Oddly enough, I finally found out what the 700 club was after reading that article last night.

I thought it was some sort of congressional show.

If any religious organization deserves to lose it's tax-exempt status, the 700 club is it. They are an extrememly political/religious organization.

 

[Kerrie]

I can't say that I have followed Pat Robertson's words of wisdom over the last decade or so , but has he always made these sort of outlandish comments? Or is it just more recently?

 

[Skyhunter]

I can't say that I have followed Pat Robertson's words of wisdom over the last decade or so , but has he always made these sort of outlandish comments? Or is it just more recently?

He always has on his television show, although he did change hhis tone when he ran for president.

 

[Astronuc]

He has been making outrageous and un-Christian statements for more than 3 decades since I have watched him on and off.

http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/revpat.htm

http://www.cygnus-study.com/pagepat.html - title of the webpage is a bit snide - but the quotes, some going back to the 80's, have attribtion.

Basically, IMO, Robertson's in it for the power and the money, and his own personal glory.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

I'd like to say to the good citizens of Dover: If there is a disaster in your area, don't turn to God. You just rejected him from your city.

Don't turn to God? I don't remember that line from the bible.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

I'm sorry I missed Pastor Robertson's clarification.
Later Thursday, Robertson issued a statement saying he was simply trying to point out that "our spiritual actions have consequences."

God is tolerant and loving, but we can't keep sticking our finger in his eye forever.

I know that eventually I would lose it and just lash out. I guess Reverend Robertson figures God is a lot like us.

 

[fourier jr]

here's some more from Bill Blum's latest anti-empire report:

Ahmed Omar Abu Ali is a 24-year-old American citizen from Virginia who went to study at a university in Saudi Arabia. He was arrested by the Saudis, interrogated, and confessed to being part of an al Qaeda plot to assassinate George W. Bush while the president was visiting the country. Abu Ali is now being held in the United States by federal authorities. His defense attorneys and his family have contended that any statements he made in Saudi custody were obtained through torture and should thus not be allowed into evidence. Two doctors who examined Abu Ali found evidence that he was tortured in Saudi Arabia, including scars on his back consistent with having been whipped, defense lawyers have said in court papers. The prosecution has argued that he was not tortured, and the judge presiding over the trial, which began October 31, has agreed to allow Abu Ali's confession into evidence.
Abu Ali confessed to the Saudis about conspiring to carry out other terrorist acts as well, but I'd like to focus here on the alleged assassination plot. Law enforcement sources cited by the Washington Post have said the plot against Bush, "never advanced beyond the talking stage". If that is indeed the case, and even assuming there was no torture involved, then I'd raise the question of whether a "crime", worthy of punishment -- and Abu Ali faces up to life in prison on the assassination charge alone -- was committed. Or does it fall in the category of a "thought crime" made famous of course in Orwell's "1984"? Someone should perhaps tell the Justice Department that "1984" was meant to be a warning, not a how-to guide.
Who amongst us has not entertained fantasies of horrible and nasty things befalling our dear George W.? I've imagined myself as the perpetrator of actions taking care of the entire Bushgang all at once, including Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Rice, Powell, Bolton and about a dozen other neo-con stars, all instantly falling victim to ... well, let's leave it at that on this FBI-patrolled Internet. But I've shared such pleasant thoughts with others in person. And they've shared theirs with me. And I'm sure that a million other Americans have had similar thoughts. Should we be indicted? How about His High Holiness Rev. Pat Robertson who publicly called for the assassination of Venezuelan president Hugo Chavez? He did it in all seriousness. Speaking to thousands of people. Without being tortured.

yeah, how was that not a thought crime?
here's other stuff from that article that i thought was pretty shocking

In October 2003, he suggested that the State Department be blown up with a nuclear device. He has also said that feminism encourages women to "kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism and become lesbians."

 

[McGyver]

Pat Robertson: Suffering from Psychosis or a Publicity Stunt

Just when I thought that the U.S. Chistian movement had reached bottom in terms of realism and practicality, Pat Robertson comes out with his latest remarks. Now these "remarks" can be taken in either of two ways: either he is suffering from a form of psychosis, or he is making these inflammatory and "threatening" statements to rally his base for more financial support.

Literally, he could be mentally ill. Such statements are common in various psychotic states. He should be immediately tested. I mean, even if he made a statement about UFO's were coming to take these people away, supporters could still argue he is of sound mind. His statement went too far, and also follows comments he made recently calling for the aasassination of President Chavez.

As a man of his position and influence, I do not believe the U.S. government and FBI can sit idle and allow such a still influential figure over several million Americans to make such threatening statements, which one could construe, as a "directive" to radical religious right operatives to take action against this town and school board. His statements certainly now have jeophardized the peace and security of that town, and is coming real close to apparent TV directives used by bin Laden to carry out violence.

The Feds and doctors must take a good look at Pat Robertson.

 

[Smurf]

Who's pat robertson and why does this matter?

 

[Art]

Who's pat robertson and why does this matter?

He's a terrorist the US gov't are sheltering who called for the assassination of a foreign elected leader. He's also a religious nut. (To be precise he claims to be religious. It is grossly unfair on genuinely religious people to actually give him that label)

 

[Loren Booda]

If he is representative of God, the poor, meek and suffering are headed for a Fall.

 

[Astronuc]

Who's pat robertson and why does this matter?

Pat Robertson is one of the early Televangelists who use television to promote their version of religion, while accumulating personal fortunes from those who donate money to his 'religious' media empire.

Robertson started the Christian Coalition, a political organization devoted to undermining the freedom of religion and separation of church and state.

IMO, Robertson has misappropriated the term 'Christianity' using for his own perversion of religion that is nothing more than 'materialism'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pat_Robertson

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_700_Club

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Coalition

He has used some of the donations for charity work, I question the integrity of his charities.

Through his charitable organization, Operation Blessing International, Robertson claims to have spent $1.2 million bringing aid to refugees in Rwanda.

from Wiki - as compared to a personal fortune estimated between $200 million and $1 billion USD according to Greg Palast.

 

[Pengwuino]

He's a terrorist the US gov't are sheltering who called for the assassination of a foreign elected leader. He's also a religious nut. (To be precise he claims to be religious. It is grossly unfair on genuinely religious people to actually give him that label)

Add that to what Fourier said and are you now supporting the jailing of all those liberals mentioned in fouriers post and people such as TSM and ... well yourself?

I guess I can finally understand your point of view on life. People who go on tv and talk a lot and do nothing are terrorists while OBL and Saddam (both responsible for many hundreds of thousands of deaths) are what... civilized businessmen?

 

[Smurf]

OBL and Saddam are what... civilized businessmen?

... That may actually be the best description I've heard yet. Certainly more accurate than the usual.

 

[Evo]

He's a terrorist the US gov't are sheltering who called for the assassination of a foreign elected leader. He's also a religious nut. (To be precise he claims to be religious. It is grossly unfair on genuinely religious people to actually give him that label)

He's not a terrorist Smurf. He's a religious nut on tv.

 

[Smurf]

He's not a terrorist Smurf. He's a religious nut on tv.

Yes, I got the sarcasm. Just because I'm blue doesn't mean I'm dumb. DESCRIMINATION! I HAVE RIGHTS TOO!

 

[Moonbear]

I caught it on the news last night. They were interviewing pastors of various other congregations in the town, and the pastors were definitely miffed, and didn't agree at all that his statements reflected the views of any religion other than Pat Robertson worshipping.

Though, in a way, I'm glad he made such an outrageous statement. Even most religious people (there were a few who thought he might be right) see him as a nut, but it got the story onto national news that every supporter of ID was voted off the schoolboard in that town. That's the part of the story I'm glad got out across the country...take heed if you're someone on a schoolboard who is pushing ignorance in the science classroom, the residents aren't going to sit quietly and let you brainwash their children.

 

[SOS2008]

Cut from the same cloth

Add that to what Fourier said and are you now supporting the jailing of all those liberals mentioned in fouriers post and people such as TSM and ... well yourself?

A quote from one person (Bill Blum) is "all those liberals?" Here's a quote from one of your favorite people, Bill O'Reilly:

"Listen, citizens of San Francisco, if you vote against military recruiting, you're not going to get another nickel in federal funds. Fine. You want to be your own country? Go right ahead," O'Reilly said, according to a transcript and audio posted by liberal media watchdog group Media Matters for America, and by the San Francisco Chronicle.

"And if al-Qaida comes in here and blows you up, we're not going to do anything about it. We're going to say, look, every other place in America is off limits to you, except San Francisco. You want to blow up the Coit Tower? Go ahead," O'Reilly continued, referring to the 1933 San Francisco landmark that sits atop Telegraph Hill.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10004302/

The fabric of America -- Pat Robertson and Bill O'Reilly are cut from the same cloth. Oh, and the above quote was deleted from the transcripts of O'Reilly's broadcast, but he is busted by the audio--not unlike the WH attempts to hide what McClellan really said in his press conference.

 

[Art]

He's not a terrorist Smurf. He's a religious nut on tv.

Some believe he is

Venezuela seeks action in US row
Hugo Chavez is an outspoken critic of the US
Venezuela's president says his government will take legal action against a US TV evangelist who called for US agents to kill him.
Hugo Chavez said Venezuela might even seek to extradite Pat Robertson. He also warned he would complain to the UN if the US failed to take action.
Mr Robertson has apologised for his comments, which came amid already tense US-Venezuela relations.
On Sunday, US civil rights leader Jesse Jackson lent support to Mr Chavez.
On a visit to Venezuela, Mr Jackson denounced Mr Robertson's assassination call as immoral and illegal.

and in a speech to the UN Chavez said

He also accused the United States of abetting "international terrorism" by failing to arrest television evangelist Pat Robertson for saying that the United States should consider assassinating Chavez.

Personally I'm not too sure what you call a guy who calls for the assassination of a head of state on national television if not a terrorist.

 

[Art]

Add that to what Fourier said and are you now supporting the jailing of all those liberals mentioned in fouriers post and people such as TSM and ... well yourself?

What?

I guess I can finally understand your point of view on life. People who go on tv and talk a lot and do nothing are terrorists while OBL and Saddam (both responsible for many hundreds of thousands of deaths) are what... civilized businessmen?

Err no.. Saddam was a vicious dictator and OBL is an international terrorist who goes on TV talks a lot does nothing himself but incites his followers to violence just like ... Yep you got it Pat Robertson.

 

[SOS2008]

...but it got the story onto national news that every supporter of ID was voted off the schoolboard in that town. That's the part of the story I'm glad got out across the country...take heed if you're someone on a schoolboard who is pushing ignorance in the science classroom, the residents aren't going to sit quietly and let you brainwash their children.

Absolutely!

General: But Robertson is not nuts IMO. After all, when unable to get capital--because banks were threatened by oil companies that they would pull their accounts if loans were given for construction of refineries (in California)--he was right about the need for refineries predicting the price of gas would go to $3. I say he is a businessman, with religion as his primary product.

 

[Tsu]

What bothers me the most is that most of the poor fools who watch his show will probably believe that what he is saying is the truth. *puking*

 

[Skyhunter]

Remember the time he claimed that God was going to call him home if his followers didn't donate enough money.

Unfortunately my great aunt is hooked on one of those televangelists, I don't know which one. It is really sad.

 

[Kerrie]

Though, in a way, I'm glad he made such an outrageous statement. Even most religious people (there were a few who thought he might be right) see him as a nut, but it got the story onto national news that every supporter of ID was voted off the schoolboard in that town. That's the part of the story I'm glad got out across the country...take heed if you're someone on a schoolboard who is pushing ignorance in the science classroom, the residents aren't going to sit quietly and let you brainwash their children.

like i said...the power of free speech!

 

[Manchot]

He's not a terrorist Smurf. He's a religious nut on tv.

So, if some other "religious nut" did decide to assassinate Chavez because of what Robertson said, how would that make him any different than bin Laden?

 

[Evo]

So, if some other "religious nut" did decide to assassinate Chavez because of what Robertson said, how would that make him any different than bin Laden?

bin Laden recruits, trains, arms and funds terrorists. Before 9/11 he had special training camps, probably still does, although more discreet.

Robertson isn't doing any of that. If some nut decides to go through with what Robertson talks about, it still doesn't make Robertson a terrorist.

 

[russ_watters]

It depends on how specific his statements are, but there is a law against "terroristic threats". Plus, if someone actually did shoot the President of Mexico and said he was "inspired" by Robertson, it could be possible to charge Robertson with a lesser charge of murder (not sure how that applies internationally).

But yeah - tough to call someone who is all talk a "terrorist".

And Penguino's point is valid - we've had quite a number of people here make suggestions/threats of violent acts. By your definition, Art, those people would be terrorists.

 

[Burnsys]

bin Laden recruits, trains, arms and funds terrorists. Before 9/11 he had special training camps, probably still does, although more discreet.
Robertson isn't doing any of that. If some nut decides to go through with what Robertson talks about, it still doesn't make Robertson a terrorist.

I know it's a little off topic but, evo, do you know who, recruited, funded armed and trained OBL and the mujaidin?

 

[Evo]

I know it's a little off topic but, evo, do you know who, recruited, funded armed and trained OBL and the mujaidin?

If you are referring to US aid, it's common knowledge. I suppose you know it was to help them regain control of their own government, not to terrorize civilians of other countries. And you're right, it has nothing to do with the topic.

 

[Smurf]

Plus, if someone actually did shoot the President of Mexico and said he was "inspired" by Robertson,

don't you mean venezuela?

 

[loseyourname]

don't you mean venezuela?

Well, if some nut killed the president of any country and claimed that Robertson incited him, Robertson could be charged if there was enough evidence. It's not an easy thing to prove, though, especially since Robertson didn't call for a follower of his to assassinate Mr. Chavez. He called for US covert ops to do it.

 

[Burnsys]

i wonder if the secret service or the fbi visited pat Robertson and O'Reilly after advocating terrorism...

But we are sure they visited this schoolkid becouse he "had taken a photo of George Bush out of a magazine and tacked the picture to a wall with a red thumb tack through his head."
http://www.alternet.org/walmart/26503/

" The Secret Service questioned a 15-year-old boy last week and confiscated drawings he made depicting President Bush as the devil"
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/04/28/national/main614193.shtml

 

[russ_watters]

don't you mean venezuela?

Yes, sorry. Anyway, here's the quote:

You know, I don't know about this doctrine of assassination, but if he thinks we're trying to assassinate him, I think that we really ought to go ahead and do it. It's a whole lot cheaper than starting a war...

We have the ability to take him out, and I think the time has come that we exercise that ability. We don't need another $200 billion war to get rid of one, you know, strong-arm dictator. It's a whole lot easier to have some of the covert operatives do the job and then get it over with.

Anyway, I threw out that "terroristic threats" thing largely as a hypothetical. Since he doesn't threaten to do it himself and he isn't calling for his followers to do it, it doesn't qualify.

 

[enigma]

He always has on his television show, although he did change hhis tone when he ran for president.

He did? I seem to recall reading that he advocated instituting a 'prayer police' squad, where the 'cops' would 'pray' for guidance, and when 'God' responded to them to tell them that someone was doing something 'evil', they had full authority to arrest him.

EDIT: Can't seem to track down a source on that, so it may not be reputable.

Those people are the worst threat to rational thought on the face of the planet.

Pat Roberson Quotes