Polar equation of a hyperbola with one focus at the origin

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around deriving the polar equation of a hyperbola with one focus at the origin. The original poster attempts to show that the equation is given by ##r=\frac {±\Lambda} {1+εcos(\theta)}##, but they encounter a discrepancy with their derived equation, leading to confusion about the validity of their result compared to the textbook answer.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the derivation of the polar equation, questioning the steps taken and the implications of the results. There is an exploration of algebraic manipulations and the conditions under which the equations hold. Some participants express uncertainty about the interpretation of the results and the relationship between the derived and expected equations.

Discussion Status

Multiple interpretations of the polar equation are being explored, with participants providing their derivations and questioning the assumptions made. Some guidance has been offered regarding the algebraic steps, but there is no explicit consensus on the correctness of the derived equations or the assumptions involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the problem involves understanding hyperbolas and their properties, with some expressing a lack of experience in this area. The discussion also highlights potential misunderstandings regarding the algebraic manipulation of the equations.

Adgorn
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Homework Statement


Hello everyone,
I have an assignment (Spivak's Calculus) to show that the polar equation of a hyperbola with the right focus in the origin is ##r=\frac {±\Lambda} {1+εcos(\theta)}##, but the equation I reached was slightly yet somewhat disturbingly different, and I'm not sure where the problem is.

Homework Equations


Distance between 2 points equation: ##r^2=x^2+y^2##
Conversion from Cartesian to polar coordinates: ##x=rcos(\theta)##, ##y=rsin(\theta)##
Condition for a point being on a hyperbola: ##r-s=±2a##
definition of ##\Lambda##: ##\Lambda=(1-ε^2)a##

The Attempt at a Solution


The development I did is as follows:

Say the difference between the distances from the foci is ##2a##, the 1st focus is in the origin and the 2nd focus is in ##(-2εa,0)## where ##ε\gt1##. The distance from the right focus will be denoted with ##r## and the distance from the left focus will be denoted with ##s##
The distance of any point ##(x,y)## in the hyperbola from the left focus is ##s=r±2a## (Since ##r-s=±2a## by assumption). The same distance is also ##s=\sqrt{(x+2εa)^2+y^2}## (by the distance equation). Furthermore, since the right focus is the origin, ##r^2=x^2+y^2##.
Thus:
i) ##(r±a)^2=(x+2εa)^2+y^2##
ii) ##r^2=x^2+y^2##

Solving the system gives the equation ##±r=(1-ε^2)a-εx##. Denoting ##\Lambda=(1-ε^2)a## and substituting ##x=rcos(\theta)## gives
iii) ##±r=\Lambda-εrcos(\theta)##.

Adding ##εrcos(\theta)## to the equation, taking out ##r## in the left side as a common factor and dividing yields the equation:
iv) ##r=\frac \Lambda {±1+εcos(\theta)}##

Which is the equation I got to, putting the equation in a graphing program such as Desmos gives a correct graph as well. However if my answer and the book's answer really are 2 ways of expressing the same equation then it means:
##\frac {±\Lambda} {1+εcos(\theta)}=\frac \Lambda {±1+εcos(\theta)}##, in other terms (the minus case), ##\frac {-\Lambda} {1+εcos(\theta)}=\frac {\Lambda} {-1+εcos(\theta)}##. This in turn implies ##1+εcos(\theta)=1-εcos(\theta)## which is bizarre since... well... ##cos(\theta)≠0## for all ##\theta##.

So what am I missing here? help and clarification would be very appreciated.
 
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Adgorn said:
Which is the equation I got to, putting the equation in a graphing program such as Desmos gives a correct graph as well. However if these really are 2 ways of expressing the same equations then it means:
##\frac {±\Lambda} {1+εcos(\theta)}=\frac \Lambda {±1+εcos(\theta)}##,
Shouldn't that be ##\frac {±\Lambda} {1+εcos(\theta)}=\frac \Lambda {±(1+εcos(\theta))}##?
IOW, the denominator on the right will be either ##1 + \epsilon\cos(\theta)## or ##-1 - \epsilon\cos(\theta)##.
Adgorn said:
in other terms, ##\frac {-\Lambda} {1+εcos(\theta)}=\frac {\Lambda} {-1+εcos(\theta)}##. This in turn implies ##1+εcos(\theta)=1-εcos(\theta)## which is bizarre since... well... ##cos(\theta)≠0## for all ##\theta##.

So what am I missing here? help and clarification would be very appreciated.
 
Mark44 said:
Shouldn't that be ##\frac {±\Lambda} {1+εcos(\theta)}=\frac \Lambda {±(1+εcos(\theta))}##?
IOW, the denominator on the right will be either ##1 + \epsilon\cos(\theta)## or ##-1 - \epsilon\cos(\theta)##.
Not if I know my algebraic operations:
I start with
iii) ##±r=\Lambda-εrcos(\theta)##
adding ##εrcos(\theta)## to both sides yields
##±r+εrcos(\theta)=\Lambda##
taking out ##r## as a common factor on the left side yields
##r(±1+εcos(\theta))=\Lambda##
and lastly dividing by ##(±1+εcos(\theta))## yields
iv) ##r=\frac \Lambda {±1+εcos(\theta)}##.
So ##εcos(\theta)## remains with a plus sign in both cases, and my issue still remains...
 
I misunderstood. I thought you were just moving the ##\pm## from the numerator of the fraction on the left to its denominator.
 
Adgorn said:
...
i) ##(r±a)^2=(x+2εa)^2+y^2##
ii) ##r^2=x^2+y^2##

Solving the system gives the equation ##±r=(1-ε^2)a-εx##. Denoting ##\Lambda=(1-ε^2)a## and substituting ##x=rcos(\theta)## gives
iii) ##±r=\Lambda-εrcos(\theta)##.
...

You get the formula ##±r=(1-ε^2)a-εx##. Does this mean that the axis of symmetry is at ##x = {\Lambda \over ε}##? Then you substitute in ##x = r \cos{\theta}##. I wonder if this should be something like ##x = {\Lambda \over ε} \pm ({\Lambda \over ε} + r \cos{\theta})##.

Anyway, that's the best I can do.
 
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verty said:
You get the formula ##±r=(1-ε^2)a-εx##. Does this mean that the axis of symmetry is at ##x = {\Lambda \over ε}##? Then you substitute in ##x = r \cos{\theta}##. I wonder if this should be something like ##x = {\Lambda \over ε} \pm ({\Lambda \over ε} + r \cos{\theta})##.

Anyway, that's the best I can do.
I'm not very experienced with hyperbolas at this point (as in, this is about the 3rd question I have ever did on them) so forgive me if I'm somewhat dull witted here. Since the foci of the described hyperbola are ##(0,0)## and ##(-2εa,0)##, then the (vertical) axis of symmetry should be to my understanding in ##x=-εa##, which is distinctly different than ##x=\frac \Lambda ε={\frac {(1-ε^2)} ε}a## for all possible ε.

Because I don't understand that I suppose it's not too surprising that I don't understand your 2nd claim about the formula for ##x##, so I'm forced to rudely ask for a slightly more basics-covering explanation...
 
Adgorn, I have checked your formula another way and I get the same result. I think the author was trying to be obtuse. He gave an answer not easily disproven. But it is not correct. And here is my philosophy about this. It's a hard question and proving him to be wrong is very difficult. I don't need to do it. I have corroborated your result and I trust you when you say it doesn't make sense. So I'm happy to move on.

Here is my derivation. Let ##c = \sqrt{a^2 + b^2}##, ##k = {a \over b}##:
$${(x + c)^2 \over a^2} - {y^2 \over b^2} = 1 \\
(x + c)^2 - k^2 y^2 - a^2 = 0 \\
(x^2 - k^2 y^2) + 2cx + b^2 = 0$$

Let ##x = r \cos\theta##, ##y = r \sin\theta##: $$r^2 (\cos^2\theta - k^2 \sin^2\theta) + 2cr \cos\theta + b^2 = 0 \\
(\cos^2\theta - k^2 \sin^2\theta) + {2c \cos\theta \over r} + {b^2 \over r^2} = 0$$

Let ##z = {1 \over r}##: $$b^2 z^2 + 2c z \cos\theta + (\cos^2\theta - k^2 \sin^2\theta) = 0 \\
z = {1 \over 2 b^2} \bigg[-2 c \cos\theta \pm \sqrt{4 c^2 \cos^2\theta - 4 b^2 (\cos^2\theta - k^2 \sin^2\theta)}\ \bigg] \\
z = {1 \over b^2} \bigg[-c \cos\theta \pm \sqrt{a^2 \cos^2\theta + a^2 sin^2\theta)}\ \bigg] \\
z = {- c \cos\theta \pm a \over b^2} \\
r = {b^2 \over \pm a - c \cos\theta}$$

To remove b and c, let ##\varepsilon = {c \over a}##. Then: $$\varepsilon^2 - 1 = {b^2 \over a^2} \\
r = {a(\varepsilon^2 - 1) \over \pm 1 - \varepsilon\cos\theta} = {a(1 - \varepsilon^2) \over \pm 1 + \varepsilon\cos\theta}$$
 

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