Probability Distribution Function, H-atom

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the probability distribution function for finding an electron in a spherical shell of thickness dr in the ground state of the hydrogen atom, as presented in Basdevant/Dalibard's text. Participants explore how to derive this distribution function and discuss related concepts such as the probability distribution for momentum.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks clarification on how to derive the probability distribution function for the hydrogen atom's ground state, specifically referencing the equation provided in Basdevant/Dalibard.
  • Another participant suggests solving the spectral equation for the hydrogen atom and deriving the probability density function by squaring the modulus of the eigenvectors of the Hamiltonian.
  • A participant explains that the radial probability distribution function can be obtained from the volume integral of the wavefunction squared in spherical coordinates, integrating over angular coordinates.
  • There is a mention of using the Fourier transform of the wavefunction to find the probability distribution function for momentum, along with a plan to calculate expectation values in momentum space.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various methods to derive the probability distribution function, but there is no consensus on a single approach or resolution of the underlying questions. Multiple viewpoints and methods remain present in the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the treatment of the continuous spectrum versus the discrete spectrum are noted, as well as the specific mathematical steps involved in deriving the probability distribution functions.

logic smogic
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I'm reading Basdevant/Dalibard on 'Stationary States of the Hydrogen Atom' in preparation for a final this week, and the "Probability distribution function" for finding an electron in a spherical shell of thickness dr in the ground state is given.

It's not derived, so I was wondering if anyone could explain how to find such a distribution function.

Momentum, for example. If I wanted to find the probability distribution function for momentum, how would I do that?

I think I've got the wavefunction for the ground state of Hydrogen:
(using the equation involving spherical harmonics, the radial equation, and n=1, l=0, m=0)
|100>=(1/a_{o})^{2/3}e^{-r/a_{o}}\sqrt{1/{4\pi}}

Any insight would be very much appreciated!

EDIT:
Oh, to clarify, Basdevant lists this as the answer for the radial probability distribution function:

P(r)dr=|\psi_{1,0,0}(r)|^2(4\pi)r^2dr

I just don't know how he got there!
 
Last edited:
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logic smogic said:
I'm reading Basdevant/Dalibard on 'Stationary States of the Hydrogen Atom' in preparation for a final this week, and the "Probability distribution function" for finding an electron in a spherical shell of thickness dr in the ground state is given.

It's not derived, so I was wondering if anyone could explain how to find such a distribution function.

Solve the spectral equation for the H atom. Assume discrete spectrum (the continuous one is harder to treat, its treatment is often missing in textbooks) and then write down the eigenvectors of the Hamiltonian. By squaring the modulus of these vectors (position wavefunctions, if you assume that you use the coordinate representation in L^{2}\left(\mathbb{R}^{3}, d^{3}x\right)) you get the probability density function for localizing the electron within an open domain from R^3.

logic smogic said:
Momentum, for example. If I wanted to find the probability distribution function for momentum, how would I do that?

Fourier transform \langle r,\theta,\phi|nlm\rangle and then consider the square modulus.

logic smogic said:
I think I've got the wavefunction for the ground state of Hydrogen:
(using the equation involving spherical harmonics, the radial equation, and n=1, l=0, m=0)
|100>=(1/a_{0})^{2/3}e^{-r/a_{0}}\sqrt{1/{4\pi}}

Any insight would be very much appreciated!

EDIT:
Oh, to clarify, Basdevant lists this as the answer for the radial probability distribution function:

P(r)dr=|\psi_{1,0,0}(r)|^2(4\pi)r^2dr

I just don't know how he got there!
 
logic smogic said:
Basdevant lists this as the answer for the radial probability distribution function:

P(r)dr=|\psi_{1,0,0}(r)|^2(4\pi)r^2dr

I just don't know how he got there!

You get it from the volume integral of |\psi_{1,0,0}(r)|^2 in spherical coordinates, integrating over the angular coordinates but not the radial coordinate:

P(r)dr=\int_0^{2 \pi} \int_0^\pi |\psi_{1,0,0}(r)|^2 r^2 \sin \theta dr d\theta d\phi

In case you or anyone else reading this needs reminding, r^2 \sin \theta dr d\theta d\phi is the volume element in spherical coordinates, like dx dy dz is the volume element in rectangular coordinates.
 
Last edited:
Fourier transform LaTeX graphic is being generated. Reload this page in a moment. and then consider the square modulus.

jtbell said:
You get it from the volume integral of |\psi_{1,0,0}(r)|^2 in spherical coordinates, integrating over the angular coordinates but not the radial coordinate:

P(r)dr=\int_0^{2 \pi} \int_0^\pi |\psi_{1,0,0}(r)|^2 r^2 \sin \theta dr d\theta d\phi

In case you or anyone else reading this needs reminding, r^2 \sin \theta dr d\theta d\phi is the volume element in spherical coordinates, like dx dy dz is the volume element in rectangular coordinates.

Okay, so for momentum, my plan of attack is to FT \psi_{1,0,0}(r) to \phi(p), and then
<\phi|p|\phi>=\int(\phi*p\phi)d^3p.
 

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