Proof of Hellmann Feynman Theorem for TD wavefunctions

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the proof of the Hellmann-Feynman theorem for time-dependent wavefunctions, specifically addressing the mathematical steps involved in the proof as presented in a Wikipedia article. Participants are exploring the implications of certain derivatives and transformations within the proof.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion regarding the appearance of total derivatives in the proof and seeks clarification on this aspect.
  • Another participant suggests that the variable lambda should not depend on other parameters such as time or position, implying that the derivative with respect to lambda should be treated as a partial derivative.
  • A further participant agrees with the previous point but questions the transformation of specific terms involving time and lambda derivatives into expressions involving the total derivative of lambda with respect to time.
  • Another participant questions the use of the notation for the derivative of lambda with respect to time, indicating a potential issue with the mathematical representation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the treatment of lambda as independent of other parameters, but there is ongoing uncertainty and disagreement regarding the specific mathematical transformations and notations used in the proof.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express confusion about the mathematical steps, particularly regarding the treatment of derivatives and the notation used, which may indicate a need for clearer definitions or assumptions in the proof.

Pablolopez
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Dear users,

I am dealing with the proof of the Hellman Feynman-theorem for time-dependent wavefunctions given by the Wikipedia:

(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellmann–Feynman_theorem#Proof_2)

I got stack:

[tex] \begin{align}<br /> &\frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda}\langle\Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)|\hat{H}|\Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle=<br /> \nonumber<br /> \\<br /> &=<br /> i\hbar \langle \frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)| \frac{\partial}{\partial t} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle <br /> +<br /> \langle \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)|\frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda}\hat{H}|\Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle -<br /> \nonumber<br /> \\<br /> &- i\hbar \langle \frac{\partial}{\partial t} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)|\frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle<br /> =<br /> i\hbar\frac{d\lambda}{dt} \langle \frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)| \frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle<br /> +<br /> \nonumber<br /> \\<br /> &+ \langle \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)|\frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda}\hat{H}|\Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle -i\hbar\frac{d\lambda}{dt} \langle \frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)| \frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle<br /> =<br /> \nonumber<br /> \\<br /> &=<br /> \langle\Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)|\frac{\partial\hat{H}}{\partial\lambda}|\Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle <br /> \end{align}[/tex]

I cannot understand the step in which the total derivatives appear, why? could somebody help me?

Thanks in advance
 
Last edited:
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I think lambda is not supposed to depend on the other parameters (time, position)
so
[tex]d/d\lambda = \partial_\lambda[/tex]
 
Thanks naima,

I agree with that, however the step to transform:
[tex] \begin{equation}<br /> i\hbar \langle \frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)| \frac{\partial}{\partial t} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle<br /> \end{equation}<br /> [\tex]<br /> <br /> and:<br /> <br /> [tex] \begin{equation}<br /> - i\hbar \langle \frac{\partial}{\partial t} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)|\frac{\partial}{\par tial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle<br /> \end{equation}<br /> [\tex]<br /> <br /> into:<br /> [tex] \begin{equation}<br /> i\hbar\frac{d\lambda}{dt} \langle \frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)| \frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle<br /> \end{equation}<br /> [\tex]<br /> <br /> and:<br /> \begin{equation}<br /> [tex] -i\hbar\frac{d\lambda}{dt} \langle \frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)| \frac{\partial}{\partial \lambda} \Phi(\textbf{r},\textbf{R},t)\rangle<br /> \end{equation}<br /> [\tex]<br /> <br /> it is still not clear.<br /> <br /> Thanks for your help![/tex][/tex][/tex][/tex]
 
Last edited:
A problem with tex?
Why do you keep using [tex]\frac{d\lambda}{dt}[\tex] ?[/tex]
 

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