Pulley attached to two objects with a rope

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    Pulley Rope
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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves a system with two blocks connected by a rope over a pulley, where one block is on a table and the other hangs vertically. The masses of the blocks and the rope, as well as the friction coefficients, are provided. The goal is to determine the minimum distance required for the blocks to start moving from rest, considering the effects of friction and the mass of the rope.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the significance of the mass of the pulley and its implications for the problem. There is confusion regarding how to apply the concept of work and the relationship between forces and distance. Some express uncertainty about how to relate the forces acting on the blocks to the distance required for movement.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the problem, questioning the assumptions about the pulley and the role of the rope's mass. Guidance has been offered regarding the importance of drawing a Free Body Diagram, and there is recognition of the complexity introduced by the mass of the rope. Multiple interpretations of the problem are being explored.

Contextual Notes

There is a mention of the need to ignore sag in the horizontal part of the rope, and participants are considering the implications of the mass of the rope on the forces involved. The absence of explicit information about the pulley’s mass leads to discussions about assuming it is mass-less and frictionless.

zm500
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Homework Statement



In the system shown in the figure , block A has mass = 2.00 , block B has mass = 0.360 , and the rope connecting them has a nonzero mass 0.240 . The rope has a total length 1.10 and the pulley has a very small radius. Let be the length of rope that hangs vertically between the pulley and block B. If there is friction between block A and the table top, with mu_Kinetic = 0.203 and mu_Static= 0.250, find the minimum value of the distance such that the blocks will start to move if they are initially at rest. Ignore any sag in the horizontal part of the rope.

http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/5571/capturejup.jpg

Homework Equations



F= ma
Torque = F*R
Work = F * ds
dx = volt + .5at^2
Vf^2 = Vo^2 + 2ax
f = mu * N

The Attempt at a Solution



The attempt at a solution
I know how to draw Free body diagram, but i got confused when the problem mentioned the mass of the pulley. What's the significance of it? Do I apply work in this? I literally no idea how to start this problem! >.<
 
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zm500 said:
I know how to draw Free body diagram, but i got confused when the problem mentioned the mass of the pulley. What's the significance of it? Do I apply work in this? I literally no idea how to start this problem! >.<

I don't see the mass of the pulley being mentioned in the problem.
 
gneill said:
I don't see the mass of the pulley being mentioned in the problem.

Well, my professor told me to always draw the Free Body Diagram, but i can't seem to find the relationship [tex]\Sigma[/tex]F = ma with finding the distance.
 
zm500 said:
Well, my professor told me to always draw the Free Body Diagram,
That's very good advice. :approve: Do that with this problem too! :smile:
but i can't seem to find the relationship [tex]\Sigma[/tex]F = ma with finding the distance.
As gneill points out, no information was given about the pulley except that it has a negligible radius. You should assume that the pulley is mass-less and frictionless.

But the rope has mass!

The force due to gravity (the pulling force) is not only a function of mass B's weight, But also the mass of the vertical portion of the rope that happens to be hanging off the pulley.

And it actually gets a little more complicated than that too. Block A is also supporting a portion of the rope's weight (the section of rope that is horizontal). Half of the horizontal portion of the rope is supported by the pulley, and the remaining half of the horizontal part is supported by block A. So the normal force is a function of the weight of the horizontal portion of the rope (and that is in addition to the weight of block A).
 

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