Question: Can elements above iron actually be clusters of smaller elements?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the hypothesis that elements with atomic numbers greater than iron might actually be clusters of smaller elements, exploring both theoretical implications and potential evidence for or against this idea. Participants engage in a conceptual examination of atomic structure, fusion processes, and the nature of heavier elements.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that elements above iron could be clusters of smaller elements, suggesting that fission might involve knocking out components of these clusters.
  • Another participant counters this idea, citing evidence such as atomic radii and binding energies that align with traditional atomic theory, implying that the proposed clusters would not differ significantly from accepted models.
  • A third participant mentions existing compounds that already exhibit configurations similar to those suggested for the clusters, questioning the validity of the initial hypothesis.
  • Another participant introduces the concept of superatoms, speculating on whether elements like gold and silver could be classified as such, while expressing skepticism about this notion but highlighting potential applications in materials science.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the hypothesis of clusters, with some supporting the idea and others providing counterarguments based on existing evidence and theories. The discussion remains unresolved, with multiple competing perspectives presented.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various theoretical frameworks and empirical evidence, but the discussion does not reach consensus on the validity of the cluster hypothesis or the implications of superatoms.

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Hello,

I would like to ask if elements of higher atomic number than iron might actually be clusters made up of smaller elements? Is there any evidence that rules out this possibility? The reason I am guessing that elements below iron are discrete is because of the theory that iron has its particles tightly bound and that energy can't be extracted from it by fusion or fission. The sun might produce all those other elements with fusion by the time it reached the stage of iron production. Maybe fission really is a process of knocking out a member of the cluster of lighter elements that make up the heavier element. Just throwing it out there.
 
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That's a very interesting idea, and I think a good one. But there is evidence that strongly implies it isn't the case.

A google search for radii of the elements will show a progression consistent with the standard theory, and additionally the binding energies are also well explained by the traditional all-elements premise.

The only way what you're suggesting would be possible is if the substituent 'elements' were so close together that there would be no difference between your theory and the currently accepted one.

I hope that makes sense. Keep questioning!
 
The problem with that theory is that there are already compounds with the same configurations you want to ascribe to elements.
 
I have read on the internet about superatoms and wondered whether heavier elements like gold, silver and others were actually superatoms. I don't believe they are, but it would be nice if they were because then a new enlightened form of alchemy might appear achievable. For instance, it would be great to make more gallium for semiconductor applications and more platinum for fuel cell applications.
 

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