Rep. Gabrielle Giffords, 6 YTBN Shot, Killed In Tuscon AZ

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  • Thread starter Thread starter nismaratwork
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the shooting incident involving U.S. Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and several others at a grocery store in Tucson, Arizona. Participants share updates on her condition, eyewitness accounts, and reactions to the unfolding events. The scope includes personal experiences, media reports, and emotional responses to the tragedy.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Meta-discussion

Main Points Raised

  • Initial reports indicated that Gabrielle Giffords had died, but later updates suggested she was alive and undergoing surgery.
  • Some participants expressed uncertainty about the motivations behind the shooting, questioning whether it was targeted or random.
  • Eyewitness accounts describe the chaotic scene, with one participant detailing their experience in the store during the shooting.
  • Conflicting reports about the number of victims emerged, with some stating 12 were shot, while later updates indicated 18 victims.
  • Participants noted the critical condition of several victims, including a child, and discussed the implications of a gunshot wound to the head.
  • There were mentions of a Federal Judge being shot alongside Giffords, adding to the severity of the incident.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the details of the incident, including the status of Giffords and the motivations of the shooter. Multiple competing views and uncertainties remain throughout the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Participants rely on evolving news reports, which may contain inaccuracies or conflicting information regarding the number of victims and the condition of Giffords. Eyewitness accounts vary in detail and emotional impact.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in firsthand accounts of traumatic events, the impact of violence on communities, and the emotional responses to public tragedies may find this discussion relevant.

  • #61
Jimmy Snyder said:
Does anyone know where to look

It’s gone, you can find it http://www.boingboing.net/2011/01/08/congresswoman-gabrie.html" .
 
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  • #62
nismaratwork said:
Better the first than the second in the irony department.

True!

I find it disturbing to see someone alive and vital, who's fighting to live as I type.

It seems that she was incredibly lucky. According to Sanjay Gupta on CNN, who is himself a neurosurgeon, that the attending neurosugeon expressed optimism that she will recover, is highly significant. One would not normally expect this given the nature of the injury.

It was a Glock 9mm, which is not something you would expect to survive at point blank.
 
  • #63
Pengwuino said:
True. I do really hope he is mentally ill, though. If he isn't, then God help us if people are capable of this.

We all are. You included. You just haven't been pushed far enough yet. I'm not saying the shooter is or isn't crazy. Most people refuse to believe that they are capable of something like this. Main difference between people is how much 'pushing' and in what way.
 
  • #64
DevilsAvocado said:
It’s gone, you can find it http://www.boingboing.net/2011/01/08/congresswoman-gabrie.html" .
I meant where to look on Palin's site. Apparently she did take it down.
 
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  • #65
Jimmy Snyder said:
I never went to www.sarahpac.com before, but I went there just now and I couldn't find the target map. Does anyone know where to look, or did she perhaps remove it. There is a statement of sympathy for the victims of the shooting.

It was originally on her FaceBook page.
 
  • #66
Pengwuino said:
For the large number of crazies in the Tea Party, it takes a special kind of person to do something like this. The more I'm hearing about this guy, he sounds like he had some political beliefs that aren't really aligned with any sizable political movement in the US.

As I posted elsewhere on PF previously, my only experience with the Tea Party is a clip from TV of a guy ranting how he wanted "all commies to die" and then threatened to kill the camera man "if he was a commie" (he said he wasn't and the guy let it go).

He was screaming and shouting and someone I believe would do as he said. I always find it disturbing to see people like this.

I know it doesn't represent the whole Tea Party, but it only takes one with this mentality to take things a bit to seriously (as with that list).
 
  • #67
DevilsAvocado said:
It’s gone, you can find it http://www.boingboing.net/2011/01/08/congresswoman-gabrie.html" .

Thanks.

http://www.boingboing.net/2011/01/08/sarahpac_0.jpg
 
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  • #68
nismaratwork said:
why do you open fire on a crowd, and a 9 year old girl?

I guess you’re right.

As a little boy, I loved guns and I used to hunt with my granddad in the woods and win shooting contests, etc, but that went over as a teenager, when my electric guitar became my gun of love.

This is clearly some "cultural clash", if I didn’t know better, I would guess that you guys are professional hitmen for god’s sake. I have absolutely no idea what caliber it takes to blow a hole in a human skull, and I’m proud of it.

I guess, and I hope, that you and Pengwuino are right. BUT, this reasoning builds on the fact the crazy gunman and Gabrielle Giffords was in the same place by pure chance and nothing more...

It’s maybe useless and dumb to speculate anymore.

My thoughts go to the 6 killed and injured...

vnles6.jpg
 
  • #69
Ivan Seeking said:
True!



It seems that she was incredibly lucky. According to Sanjay Gupta on CNN, who is himself a neurosurgeon, that the attending neurosugeon expressed optimism that she will recover, is highly significant. One would not normally expect this given the nature of the injury.

It was a Glock 9mm, which is not something you would expect to survive at point blank.

I'm stunned... and the surgeon stated clearly that the bullet passed through the brain. At this point, I'm sure her doctors are stunned too.


DA: I know what you mean about the professional hitmen; they're psychopaths, and these people are psychopaths as well. Both are predators of their own kind, both for reasons a sane person would reject, and both are just plain scary. Just remember, we have a sensational media, and while this is terrible, until I see anything but a continued drop in national murder rates, I'm accepting that this is unusual and the rest is mostly media distortion.
 
  • #71
nismaratwork said:
I'm stunned... and the surgeon stated clearly that the bullet passed through the brain. At this point, I'm sure her doctors are stunned too.


DA: I know what you mean about the professional hitmen; they're psychopaths, and these people are psychopaths as well. Both are predators of their own kind, both for reasons a sane person would reject, and both are just plain scary. Just remember, we have a sensational media, and while this is terrible, until I see anything but a continued drop in national murder rates, I'm accepting that this is unusual and the rest is mostly media distortion.

Professional hitmen are psychopaths?
 
  • #72
My wife and I visited Tucson several times during my mother's last years there (2005-08), so we were naturally curious about exactly where this happened. The national TV news reports apparently don't consider this information important for a national audience, so I had to rummage around Tucson TV web sites for a while. I finally found it: the Safeway on Oracle Road at Ina, about a mile north of the motel where we always stayed, and where we usually shopped for groceries. :eek:
 
  • #73
Newai said:
Professional hitmen are psychopaths?

Phhhh... OK... let me clarify:

The profile of a the kind of "professional murder for hire" architect that people refer to as a "hitman", is that of a high functioning sociopath/psychopath (Now called Anti-Social Personality Disorder). So... yes.

In this modern age, we have a kind of narco-child soldier who the media calls hitmen, but are really just like child soldiers everywhere... they're traumatized certainly, but their acts often don't reflect their own choices.
 
  • #74
jtbell said:
My wife and I visited Tucson several times during my mother's last years there (2005-08), so we were naturally curious about exactly where this happened. The national TV news reports apparently don't consider this information important for a national audience, so I had to rummage around Tucson TV web sites for a while. I finally found it: the Safeway on Oracle Road at Ina, about a mile north of the motel where we always stayed, and where we usually shopped for groceries. :eek:

Oh... you have GOT to put that here: https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=16317&page=9
 
  • #75
I've now seen Mathamateur's report earlier in this thread. I hope he isn't as shook up about this as I would have been if I had been there.
 
  • #77
At this point, all I can say is that clearly the actions of paramedics, and everyone who rendered first aid and primary care saved a lot of lives, and at least gave this woman a chance. That's to be commended, although I haven't heard anything about it on the news... shocker.Jared: OMG... it's Ivan... he's Sylar!
 
  • #78
  • #79
Jimmy Snyder said:
I meant where to look on Palin's site. Apparently she did take it down.

What!? "Chinese censorship"?? www.sarahpac.com works just fine from Sweden?

SP is giving her "sincere condolences are offered to the family of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and the other victims of today's tragic shooting in Arizona".

Which to me means her map (gone) was not smartest move in the world...

Try http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:o0grR1HQrV0J:www.sarahpac.com/+http://www.sarahpac.com/&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=en" and let me know if this doesn’t work.


EDIT: Misunderstanding, "she did take it down" [the site], sorry...
 
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  • #80
I think Palin's ad was neither offensive or dumb, it was an evidently playful manner of identifying key political antagonists.

That they have pulled that ad down now is the only decent thing they could do.

Not because the ad was indecent in itself, but that the massacre has irredeemably poisoned it, through no fault of Palin's or her associates.

If they HAD kept the ad going, though, they would themselves have become grossly offensive.

If somebody throws garbage on your clothes, you should not wear those soiled pieces of cloth, but find something else to wear.
 
  • #81
Pengwuino said:
From everything I'm hearing about the guy and the people who were shot, I wonder if the judge was the target.

http://www.youthlaw.org/litigation/ncyl_cases/healthmental_health/1/

A good question --- just too much time in the courtroom with people who lack the mental stability to be loose on the streets? Bad scene.
 
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  • #82
DevilsAvocado said:
What!? "Chinese censorship"??
We're not communicating well. I meant she took down the map, not the site.
 
  • #83
arildno said:
I think Palin's ad was neither offensive or dumb,

Riflescopes and "17 more to go" is a smart ad...? :eek:
 
  • #84
Jimmy Snyder said:
We're not communicating well. I meant she took down the map, not the site.

Yeah I know... check the EDIT part... ;)
 
  • #85
DevilsAvocado said:
Riflescopes and "17 more to go" is a smart ad...? :eek:

Not being dumb doesn't imply smart. It was just an ad. No one makes a big deal out of anything until something happens, which means it is just knee-jerk reactionary complaints. There have been ads like this for decades and no one complained because no sane person is going to take an ad and use it as a call to arms to go kill someone in real life. A crazy person doesn't need an ad, however.
 
  • #86
arildno said:
I think Palin's ad was neither offensive or dumb, it was an evidently playful manner of identifying key political antagonists.

You probably don't live in a country where guns are as prevalent as the US. IMO, identifying targets of a political campaign with gun scopes is both offensive and dumb.
 
  • #87
lisab said:
You probably don't live in a country where guns are as prevalent as the US. IMO, identifying targets of a political campaign with gun scopes is both offensive and dumb.
ACTUALLY, we have a much higher ownership percentage of guns here in Norway than "over there".

We use them to kill moose&grouse.

Or, should that be goose&mice? :confused:
 
  • #88
Has anyone seen a picture of this person? I can not see videos on this computer.
 
  • #89
DevilsAvocado said:
Riflescopes and "17 more to go" is a smart ad...? :eek:

Is intelligence a two-valued variable? :confused:
 

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