Ring in which Quotient and Remainder not Unique

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves finding an example of a commutative ring and two polynomials such that the remainder after division is not unique. The context is within the study of polynomial rings and their properties, particularly focusing on the uniqueness of remainders in division.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss various rings, including ##\Bbb{Z}_4##, ##\Bbb{Z}_6##, and ##\Bbb{Z}_8##, and explore the use of polynomial pairs to find a non-unique remainder. There is mention of using matrix rings and the structure of polynomial rings as potential avenues for examples. Some participants express uncertainty about the appropriate level of complexity expected in the examples.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants sharing their thoughts on potential examples and expressing the need for hints rather than direct solutions. There is a recognition of the challenge in finding suitable rings and polynomials, and some guidance has been offered regarding possible directions to explore.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that certain mathematical concepts, such as matrix rings, have not been introduced in their studies, which may limit their ability to find examples. There is also a consideration of whether the lack of principal ideal domains could provide a counterexample.

Bashyboy
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Homework Statement


Give an example of a commutative ring ##R## and ##f(x), g(x) R[x]## with ##f## monic such that the remainder after dividing ##g## by ##f## is not unique; that is, there are ##q,q',r,r' \in R[x]## with ##qf + r = g = q' f + r'## and ##\deg (r)## and ##\deg (r')## are both strictly less than ##\deg(f)##.

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution



Okay. I have been thinking about this problem for a rather long time ---I've been foiling for hours (perhaps an exaggeration). I have tried several pairs of polynomials when the base ring is ##\Bbb{Z}_4##, ##\Bbb{Z}_6##, and ##\Bbb{Z}_8##. My strategy was to solve for ##q## when ##r=0##; and then find a ##q'## given some nonzero ##r'##. I set up with equations with five variables so that I could find a nonzero remainder with ##\deg (r) < \deg (f)##, but I could find no values for these five variables. I could use a hint on finding a ring ##R## and polynomials ##f(x)## and ##g(x)##. But please don't just hand them to me; I would like to figure out this problem on my own as much as possible.
 
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I don't know an example either, but when it comes to factorization and exceptions, the matrix rings are a good address to look for examples. This way you avoid all the stuff which comes in with fields and their extensions. Or you could look at ##R[x,y]=R[y][x]##.
 
Well, since matrix rings haven't been introduced yet, I suspect that the author of the book I am using has something more elementary in mind.
 
Bashyboy said:
Well, since matrix rings haven't been introduced yet, I suspect that the author of the book I am using has something more elementary in mind.
Try ##\mathbb{Z}[\sqrt{-3}]## or ##\mathbb{Q}[-\sqrt{5}]##.
 
Unfortunately these haven't been introduced either.
 
But polynomial rings have been introduced? So what about my other example ##R[y]## as ring and polynomial ring ##R[y][x]\,##? But I haven't thought about whether the fact that it is no principal ideal domain is already sufficient to supply a counterexample.
 

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