Solving Cosmology Problem: Helium Ionization at Recombination

  • Thread starter Thread starter Dracovich
  • Start date Start date
AI Thread Summary
The discussion revolves around calculating the temperature at which the fractional ionization of helium is 1/2 during the recombination phase of the universe. The participant initially struggles with isolating temperature (T) in the relevant equation and attempts various methods, including Taylor expansions and logarithmic transformations, to derive a solution. They eventually arrive at two potential solutions for T, one of which is approximately 8700K, while the other is excessively high. After correcting calculation errors, they find a more accurate result of around 6730K, but express concern about taking the logarithm of a quantity with units. The conversation highlights the complexities of solving cosmological equations without computational tools.
Dracovich
Messages
87
Reaction score
0
Cosmology problem

Ok I've been trying to work on this assignment and it's driving me crazy agh, I'm pretty sure i should be able to do this with my hands and not need the use of maple or anything, although i do think the others used maple in the end and got a result of something like 7000K, but ok here's the question from the book:

"Imagine that at the time of recombination, the baryonic portion of the unvierse consisted entirely of ^4 He (that is, helium with two protons and two neutrons in its nucleus). The ionization energy of helium (that is the energy required to convert neutral He to He^+ is Q_{He}=24,6eV. At what temperature would the fractional ionization of helium be X=1/2? Assume that \eta=5.5 \cdot 10^{-10} and that the number density of He^{++} is negligably small. [The relevatn statistical weight factor for the ionization of helium is g_{He}/(g_{e}g_{He^+}=1/4]."

Ok so here's what I've been doing so far:

The book already did the calculations on this assuming a Hydrogen only universe, so i redid the derivation with He and simply came to the same equation times 1/4, so the equation I'm assuming i should be working with is:

\frac{1-X}{X^2}=\frac{1}{4}3.84\eta \big( \frac{kT}{m_{e} c^2} \big)^{3/2} exp{\frac{Q}{kT}}

Where k is boltzmans constant. Then putting X=1/2, and putting it all to the power of 2/3 and throwing the constants on the left side i get:

\big( \frac{2}{0.96\eta} \big)^(2/3) = \frac{kT}{m_{e}c^2} exp{\frac{2Q}{3kT}}

And this is where i run into problems, i can't seem to isolate T properly. I at least can't do it without the help of maple or such as far as i can see, at least not in its unchanged form. So i tried to do some taylor expansions to see if i could solve it, but I've had no luck, i get a result but it's usually quite ludicrous numbers, first i tried expanding exp{\frac{2Q}{3kT}} just to the second expansion, but I'm guessing the number becomes too big since it's divided by k, so then i tried to take the natural logarithm on both sides, and then trying to do a taylor expansion on ln(kT) around the point kT=1 since that should be a relatively small number. I got a better result from that, i'll show my calculations so you can see if i go wrong somewhere:

ln on both sides
ln( \big( \frac{2}{0.96\eta} \big)^{2/3} )= ln( \frac{kT}{m_{e}c^2} exp{\frac{2Q}{3kT}})

Using a few logarithm rulse
\frac{2}{3} ln(\frac{2}{0.96\eta})= ln(kT)-ln(m_{e}c^2) +\frac{2Q}{3kT}

Putting in ln(x)=x-1 for a taylor expansion
\frac{2}{3} ln(\frac{2}{0.96\eta})= (kT-1)-ln(m_{e}c^2) +\frac{2Q}{3kT}

isolating the T's (and collecting the two ln's on the left side into one).
\frac{2}{3} ln(\frac{2m_{e}c^2}{0.96\eta})+1= kT+\frac{2Q}{3kT}

\frac{2}{3} ln(\frac{2m_{e}c^2}{0.96\eta})+1= \frac{3kT^2+2Q}{3kT}

Define my constants:

\frac{2}{3} ln(\frac{2m_{e}c^2}{0.96\eta})+1=24,46=K_1
2Q=49,6=K_2

So i have:

K_1=\frac{3x^2+K_2}{x} -> 0=3x^2 - x \cdot K_1 + K_2

And solving for x:

x=\frac{K_1 \pm \sqrt{K_1^2 - 4K_2}}{2 \cdot 3} = \frac{24,5 \pm \sqrt{598,6 - 198,4}}{6} =\frac{24,5 \pm 20}{6}

From this i get two solutions x_{1}=0.75 and x_{2}=7,4. Now the first one gives a somewhat good answer, around 8700K, which is decent but it still seems to be quite a big % off from what people got solving it with the computer, the other one is ridiculously high, but I'm not sure i would argue that i use the other one, other then intuitively i wouldn't expect it to be correct. Also in this all i did take the logarithm of a number with units (i used m_{e}c^2 = 511000ev), so I'm not sure how i could get around taht either. Any suggestions?
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
I actually didn't think this assignment was too bad, until i got around to having to solve
<br /> \math{\frac{1-X}{X^2}=\frac{3.84 \eta}{4} \left(\frac{k T}{m_e c^2}\right)^{3/2} \exp{\left(\frac{Q}{k T}\right)}}<br />
which not even Maple liked to solve, i told me \math{1.440994055 \times 10^{16]} which is opviously wrong, so i rearanged the equation a bit to give me
\left(\frac{2}{3}\right) \ln\left(\frac{\left(\frac{1-X}{X^2}\right)}{\frac{3.84}{4} \eta)}\right)=\ln\left(\frac{k T}{m_e c^2}\right)+\left(\frac{2}{3}\right) \left(\frac{Q}{k T}\right)
Which Maple tells me gives 1.440994053 \times 10^{16} K,\ 6702.288018 K where i assume it is the second answer we are looking for.
ok, so we've gotten to a good answer, but i would much rather know how to get to that answer than just using Maple to find it. Can anyone help us, please?
 
Caught quite a few calculations errors and got it now :) First off i was putting 2/3 in front of the ln and then joining the two, and i put my second degree equation up a little nicer, and got damn close this time. Ended up with this equation now:

ln((\frac{2}{0.96\eta})^{2/3}m_{e}c^2)+1=28.85=K_1
\frac{2}{3}Q=K_2

And the final equation:

K_1=x+\frac{K_2}{x} =&gt; 0=x^2-K_1x+K_2

And then two x's one crazy high and one was 0,58 which gives 6730K.

So now i got the right result, but i still took the logarithm of a number with units attatched to it (the rest energy of an electron), so I'm not quite sure how i can argue that :/
 
Thread 'Collision of a bullet on a rod-string system: query'
In this question, I have a question. I am NOT trying to solve it, but it is just a conceptual question. Consider the point on the rod, which connects the string and the rod. My question: just before and after the collision, is ANGULAR momentum CONSERVED about this point? Lets call the point which connects the string and rod as P. Why am I asking this? : it is clear from the scenario that the point of concern, which connects the string and the rod, moves in a circular path due to the string...
Thread 'A cylinder connected to a hanged mass'
Let's declare that for the cylinder, mass = M = 10 kg Radius = R = 4 m For the wall and the floor, Friction coeff = ##\mu## = 0.5 For the hanging mass, mass = m = 11 kg First, we divide the force according to their respective plane (x and y thing, correct me if I'm wrong) and according to which, cylinder or the hanging mass, they're working on. Force on the hanging mass $$mg - T = ma$$ Force(Cylinder) on y $$N_f + f_w - Mg = 0$$ Force(Cylinder) on x $$T + f_f - N_w = Ma$$ There's also...
Back
Top